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Saturday, November 5, 2011

S03 E08 This weeks Episode Sister Wives: Another Wife

 How do you explain the case of one of the world's most famous polygamists to a polygamist family?  That's a question that gets answered Sunday night on TLC's hit show "Sister Wives." On the reality series, Cody Brown has four wives, and 17 children.
On this Sunday's episode, Brown takes on the challenge of explaining to his children the case of Warren Jeffs, the leader of the 10,000-member Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Jeffs is serving 20t years for sexual assault on a 12-year-old girl and a 15-year-old girl he claimed were his "spiritual wives."
Brown calls Jeffs "evil" and takes him to task for his crimes. "Sister Wives" airs at 9 p.m. Sunday nights on TLC.

I bet it's a bunch of bull about how they don't take underage brides. Yeah, we GET it Browns!   What about all the other Joseph Smith propaganda??



  1. Just because the AUB doesn't believe in Bonking underage girls - will not stand to make them a o.k. with me. Planets, Kolob, God having wives, everyone having in heaven, still creep me out totally as blasphemy.

    On a lighter note, I got a GREAT email from... An Anonymous (not sure if they wanted me to use their name) And read how expensive the LIV products are.

    ""I just wanted to say that I found a website for someone selling Liv products and that stuff is expensive! The address is www.livgreennow.net. Prices range from $57 for certain pills to upwards of $100 for drink mixes. These prices are for a 30-day supply! And to get the full weight loss kit- get ready- it's $358!""

    Isn't that crazy? Weight loss in a pill for that much money. hmm.. Got to pay the others on that pyramid.


    When you open up the comments, at the bottom pick NAME/URL - and pick a name and use it! You don't have to have an URL.


  2. AMWAY BABY. Gotta love it, old ideas within tight circles. The ole pyramid family style. I chuckle when invited to Tupperware Parties, Pearl Paries, Mary Kaye Parties, every neighbor seems to be harking something. So, the Browns are getting mainstream?? on us.

  3. $358 for the kit? I was reading their site-LIV! when the Browns were at the Tropicana for the LIV! seminar. It had mentioned the detox kits were $250-plus cruise points. Maybe it was the base cost and the higher price is the RETAIL COST? I figured it would just be a matter of time before these DETOX programs are mentioned, but of course in a better way then 'weight detox program'. What ever happened to the Real Estate license thingys? Not only was there an episode about it, Robyn 'tweeted' about it? Many on another site only felt Janelle had the smarts to pass (Meri was not doing it.)

  4. I bet it's 250 plus this...plus that... you know how THAT goes.

    As far as this episode.... i pray there's some good stuff for this blog, for if I get preached at by Kody about underage, I'll puke. What are we supposed to do? Pat them on the back he doesn't snog underage?
    but 19 is ok?

  5. it's no surprise that MLM products are expensive. where do you think the $$ have to come from to pay all the downlines the big bucks???

    and that's why recruitment for downlines are so heavily promoted. BECAUSE that's who buys the over-priced products to keep the whole racket in motion. capiche?

    if enough gullibles sign up under Team Kody, then Team Kody will make the big bucks but their gullible fans won't. but even Team Kody's rake will be shortlived. Once their fifteen minutes of fame are gone, so will their downline be.

  6. Facial expressions at the table great. Agree, a big medal for Kody for not snoggong a 17 or 18 yr old future Vegas wife. GEEZ, now with the separate houses it is like a divorce. Wonder how the expenses and child support equal out? Has to be a nightmare financially. Now with public schools can you see the school fundraisers, etc...wrapping paper and chocolate come to mind.......What a trip with multiple homes and ever growing divergence on home styles.

  7. AUB members are just very lucky that the sickos they have had on their "Priesthood Council" in the not too distant past, never got to the top position. Three were sex offenders telling their victims that it was a "special blessing." If the timing had been just a little different, AUB would have been the same kind of cesspool as the FLDS. and btw Kody, it was only a few years back that underage relationships were considered OK in AUB (only fear of the law stopped it) so there is nothing to boast about.

  8. That's right. AUB has no great past- if what I have read is right, many molesters in the group, and only recently have taken on the Mantra no underage brides to suit the masses.
    I wonder if Kody will use this term he likes to describe underage brides:
    "The vulgarity sickens me" lol

  9. What is it about polygamy that not only fosters but attracts sexual predators? Is it the built-in master/slave relationship that is enforced by the religious doctrine?

    There seem to be a higher prevalence of sexual predators in the fundamental polygamous communities, and this point is always ignored by the producers of this show (along with the entire Brown family).

    I just don't get it.

  10. That would be a great question for Troy.

    From what I have amassed, it has something to do with the whole reason this "religion" LDS or Fundy Mormonism was based on. Tthe basis of the concept was sexual deviancy. I guess when men get that kind of power and it's all about sex and not about relationships, sex prevails and then it becomes more and more deviant. They try to say this is God's work? That you automatically get to heaven if you srew alot and take 3 wives? No, I don't believe so.

    What makes me so damn mad at this family is that they want their religious freedom, yet, are such scardy cats to talk about Kolob and all of that. Tomorrow's show will be the same - there will be no real religious talk here, oh, Kody might blast Warren Jeffs, WHO COULDN'T? Does that suddenly make Mormonism right, no way!
    If you are big enough in your pants to have 4 wives and sue the goverment for thinking about arresting you for a CRIME, be a big enough man to get on public TV, possibly lose your gravy money, and tell what your religion believes in. He won't. He really doesn't have any religious principle. Other than, chuckle chuckle, let's have a lot of wives!

    If you are basing your reltionships on sex and not on emotions and commitment, that's what you get.
    He says he's committed, but he is not.

  11. Does this pattern look religious?


    Is he paying them back now?

    Sorry, I'll climb off my box now. My weight was bending it anyway hee hee

  12. Since so many were troubled by the Betty video, I took it off. Everyone has different tastes in humor-but we don't want to offend here!

    I hope that clears that up, and all is well.
    On to Kodyville!

  13. I am sooo looking forward to the show - and even more to Cynical Jinx's review! I just hope they give her enough material!

  14. I'm really sad to hear that, MSB. I thought the idea of this site was to foster discussion on the topic of polygamy/polygyny (in addition to talking about the show "Sister Wives").

    You can't let people scare you off from bringing up potentially controversial stuff; otherwise, the mandate of this site may as well be of one big love-in and gossip session about a reality show.


  15. I was sad that the Betty vid was removed too. The whole beginning of the LDS is so STUPID (sorry if that offends but its really how I feel) and that religion is proof of how many gullible people are in this world and that's just the mainstream LDS, get into the fundies and it gets even weirder. I love it!! lol

  16. You know-I'm convinced. Back it goes. For those that don't care for it, please just don't go back to it.

  17. I come by this blog time to time. I am one who enjoys the Browns very much, and like them.
    Although I am on their side in many ways, I don't like the religion, and never will. However as people, they are really nice folks.

    I know sometimes people on the "love" blog say this one is negative. I have found that all the writers seem very fair. I think it's the comments that give people the impression this is a blog against the Browns. One can't always control that, and even I have to concede, when your on TV, you have to take the good with the bad.

    I happen to think Kody is a hoot. I think he is nice, and would be a nice husband. Janelle is my favorite wife.
    I hope they counsel these folks well. It sounds like they need to go to the LDS church, though.

  18. Whoohooo Mister Sister, love your work!! Janelle Kody I think most people here like or liked watching sister wives but that doesn't mean we approve of their lifestyle or all of their decisions.
    I don't think this blog is negative, I think its truthful and lots of people can't take that.
    I have to disagree about Kody, I think he is thoughtless and I don't think he would make a good husband because he is only around (at best) 25% of the time.
    As for needing to go to the LDS church, I don't think anyone 'needs' to go there LOL. Are you LDS? What do you think of the church's origins? Don't they sound slightly wacky to you?

  19. No I am not LDS at all.
    Just very liberal as far as what others want.

  20. I am a first time poster. I am a not of this faith, but completely feel that everyone has the right to live their lives the way they want to as long as they aren't hurting anyone else. The Browns are doing exactly that. I do watch the show and think they are doing a great job in a not so idealic situation. No one should have to run and hide to be with their family(s). I pray for them and hope all works out for them and they can have their family under at least two roofs soon. Not my life style but I'm not the judge and to my belief there is only one.
    I'll be watching tonight.

  21. (EYES ROLLING & SMH)...uuggghhhh!! Tryna mentally prepare for Kody's redundant BS!!
    Seriously, tell us something new!!

    Also, I'm so tired of their excessive sugar coated interviews on talk shows, etc....
    I think it would be fun & interesting for SWB to compile a list of hard hitting questions from posters that we would like to ask the Browns in a "mock interview " + select a famous interviewer/ or talk show host who would be sucessful in making them squirm & actually answer the questions instead of pleading the 5th or just being vague :/ We all know that the Browns are fame whores & can be bought, so IMO large sum $$$ would definitely be an incentive for them to sit in the "Hot seat" in the presence of Katie Couric or Barbara Walters!!...lol

  22. "Sony said:
    No one should have to run and hide to be with their family(s)."

    That is the kicker, the Browns DIDN'T have to run and hide. No one was prosecuting them and they knew it.

    The fact that they made it into TV drama says a lot about their motives imo.

  23. Well taking down the Betty video is the last straw for me and this blog. There will be other blogs re this show where the freedom to have a sense of humor will be encouraged. How sad that you're now bowing to the sour-faced masses. This really could have been a great blog.

  24. Quick clarification for a new reader/viewer:

    Are the Browns AUB? Do they ever even mention this? I feel like they never talk specifically about their own personal faith; they just give a broad overview of polygamist/ fundamentalist Mormon beliefs...

    Am I wrong or have I missed something?

  25. Sony also said "everyone has the right to live their lives the way they want to as long as they aren't hurting anyone else." Problem is, polygamy DOES hurt others. What an unstable mess for children for instance, where they are never sure if Dad will be bringing home another woman (or that woman's children), not to mention the fact that family resources keep getting watered down because of it, not to mention that other men in these groups won't even get one partner because others are hogging multiple women, not to mention that Dad has little one- on- one time with his children, and that he has progressively less time for each woman involved, not to mention the emotional problems for women that come from repressing their normal feelings in an attempt to fulfill their religious duty. Sony, try reading that sentence in one breath and you might want to re-think that worn out argument about polygamy "not hurting anyone."

  26. Lurker - they are definitely AUB. You are right that they never mention it on the show, but it is known by ex AUB commenters on this blog and also shows up in the last legal document that Janelle submitted to the courts in Utah.

  27. I am curious where the information is coming from that Christine's mother is no longer in the AUB? I found that comment interesting and cannot find any information confirming it. Does anyone know?

  28. Cindy Lou, go here

  29. Anony 10:21 - If you look, I put it right back up last night, it wasn't off 10 minutes.

  30. Anony 10:21 - If you look, I put it right back up last night, it wasn't off 10 minutes.

  31. Good Decision "big girl panty wearer" Mister Sister!!

    there's absolutely no reason to start censoring due to a few naysayers. once you start that, where would you have to start drawing the line to stop?

  32. I like talking about the show and Kodisms, That is why I visit, the rest is boring. But the family and show, great fun.

  33. There are too many names (Jessop) and locations (Short Creek) that pop up in the Browns. Though they try and distance themselves, I'm sure they are connected to the group from Short Creek. Maybe that's why Christine's mom and some sibs left the church?

  34. Well, there's that whole fiasco of Christine's mom's uncle murdering her husband's (Christine's dad) grandfather over rivalry within the church! Nice bunch!

  35. just so you know - Short Creek is the old name for the current names of the two cities that sit side by side which are Hilldale, UT and Colorado, City, AZ. and has always been the established base home of the FLDS once they came back from hiding out in Mexico.

    Short Creek was the featured raid back in the 50's where the govt. got huge bad PR for yanking the children away from their mothers. History repeated itself w/the raid in Texas. but at least that one ultimately netted them Warren Jeffs!

  36. Short creek is FLDS, not AUB. The two split 60 years ago. If you educate yourself pool queen, you will see how wrong you are. For example, the Brown women don't dress in frontier style clothing. And they don't Believe in the Law of Placement, and don't believe in the Adam-God Doctrine.

    The Brown are Independent Fundamentalist Mormons.

    I really should stop wasting my time on this blog.

  37. Owen Allred is perhaps best known for his outspoken criticism of child abuse and marriages of girls under the age of 18. He publicly denounced the child abuse that occurred in many polygamist groups and encouraged members of the AUB to report such activities to law enforcement officials. Additionally, he campaigned for the legal marriage age in Utah to be raised from 14 to 16, noting that AUB members are forbidden to engage in any courtship before the age of 17.

    You guys really should stop assuming you know what Christine's family beliefs are.

  38. Freeandclear they aren't hurtinganyone. Get over it.

  39. Quit being hateful!! If someone is wrong, simply point out the facts.

    AND, funny, Owen was also in many a scandal, and his dtr. married at 17, so, no, he was not NOT perfect.


  40. How does anyone really know what goes on if your not in the group? They are very secretive, and seem to change the rules as they see fit.

    Although, out of all the Fundy Mormons it does seem to be the best group.

  41. Anon 2:01PM, what is the Law of Placement?

  42. The Law of Placement, in short, basically gives a group leader the ability to reassign Mothers and their children to another man. (i.e. A husband is excommunicated or dies) It's part of the concept in some extreme FLDS sects that your salvation comes from obedience to your leaders, and thus Women have very little control or free will. Essentially, their is this idea that only Leaders of the sect can be privy to the Devine will of god in knowing who you should marry. People need to understand that this kind of Warren Jeffs extreme behavior is not prevalent in all FLDS sects. Most sects abhor arranged marriage. The law also applies to young women who Mary for the first time. The group leader, through "inspiration" decides who she will marry.

  43. As far as I know the AUB believe in the Adam/ God doctrine. Would be very very surprised if they didn't.

  44. No. The doctrine remains very contavercial with the AUB. Some extreme FLDS still believe this bizaar theology, but mainstream LDS rejected it in the late 1800's. This was one of many points that lead members to split off and form the new Bretheren.

  45. What is the Adam/God doctrine?

    Browns are AUB, they said it one time on the show...first season perhaps.

  46. The doctrine, in short, teaches that Adam is god, Eve is one of his wives from another planet, and they came to earth to populate it, thus exulting themselves in the Celestial Kingdome. It is the basis behind they ideology that Polygamists strive toward large families. Having a large family is sacred, and the privileged duty to populate earth is part of what exalts them in the afterlife.

    It's also why LDS based religions say "Our Father in Heaven..."

  47. I want to point out that while the AUB, FLDS, and other organized religions have a basic theology that is taught and printed by the respective churches. The person earlier may be right in stating that the Browns are AUB, however lets not assume that they agree with 100% of that theology. You may be Jewish for example, but not whole heartedly adhear to complex food laws. I am Anonomous 7:00 5:24 5:35 and a few others by the way. That is why I conceder the Brown family more along the lines of independent.

  48. OK I am going to try this. I have been posting here a long time and don't have a google account so I was always anon 11:11. (Won't this allow others to use my name if they wanted to impersonate me?)

    Anyway I am looking forward to seeing this AUB couple who have 6 children but the husband doesn't feel it would be right to leave his wife alone in bed to be with other wives. I should be interesting.

  49. Yes, Pili...others could impersonate you, except it's too hard to spell your name so you are probably safe LOL!

    It would sure help is all these random anonymouses would pick a name! It's not rocket science! Just click on name/url and stick in your cat's name!

  50. I hope Amazing Race starts on time tonight. I keep missing half of Sister Wives because Amazing Race gets started late.

    Why is this other AUB couple on saying the husband WANTS to have plural wives but CAN'T because he doesn't feel it would be fair to his 1st wife to have to sleep alone when he is with other wives? LOL I feel like he is a TLC plant just to get The Brown's reaction to his devotion to his 1st wife and six children. Like I said it SHOULD be interesting. I sure hope The Brown's don't convince the guy to marry other wives.

  51. Sometimes it's a shame you cannot tell realtv from reality...
    passing judgement is so easy over the tv, the internet et al..
    just saying

  52. The Religious one- Christine said that what we saw was REAL, not reality. That it was the way it was. Are you calling her a liar? LOL (just kidding)

  53. Some one give us blow by blow account of what is happening- some of us can't get it!!!

  54. OMG. I feel brain washed after this episode. Please SOMEONE clean OUT my BRAIN!!!!!!!!!

    What a bunch of propaganda! That man is gonna take on more wives because of them! I am SOOOOO disappointed.

  55. What is up with this video?

    It is a teen LDS answering questions, but her eyes darting around, I could hardly stand to watch. Its like she KNOWS it is bullcrap but she's just saying what she is supposed to.

    And that line about believing only in one God, that is a flat out lie.

  56. I haven't seen the episode, my DH and 24 yo daughter are watching Cars 2 LOL.

    But I want to know why we are supposed to give them some sort of accolades for not marrying children.

    Sorry, but that isn't something you need praised for-- cause the rest of us aren't either dumbass.

    It's like me complaining about something my husband does and his come back being "well, I don't beat you" No shit, that is a given.

    Ok, off my soapbox now. That particular point was just pissing me off.

  57. I feel jipped with the time change. Like I'm having to wait an extra hour now to see the show....

    Only going off the post, haven't seen the show yet, but - Why would Kody need to explain Warren Jeff's to the kids? They watch tv, they have internet access, so wouldn't they, just like the rest of he world already have known about this? It seems planted to me...

    Too bad the editors don't just let them do/say what they want. My guess is a lot of what happens is pre-planned and not as realistic as they would like us to think.

  58. I will scream because they never get to the meat of the matter. the dance around it.

  59. I think Kody was "explaining" Warren Jeffs to the kids not for their sake but because TLC thought it would make good tv.

  60. I am new to this blog. First time to post. I am certinlly not a believer in plural marriage, but I do enjoy the brown family. My 15 year marriage ended in 1 day when I found out that my husband was having an affair with a friend of ours. I kicked him out that night and filled for divorce the next day. I prayed for god to lift me up, and he has done just that. Even as a single mother to a wonderful son I am mentally, physically and definatly financially 10 times better than when I was married to a cheater. That said, I think that the Brown Family are very loving to each other and their children with the exception of Robyn, who seems to be pulling the whole family down. I love christine's honesty, Meri's confidence she seems to get from being 1st wife, but my favorite is Janelle. I can see that she has self esteem issues, but what I really see is how independent she is and how she seems to have the most "normal" kids. Maddie is great. I would love to see Janelle just slap the s*#t out of Robyn the next time she starts to cry and whine. And call her out on what she has "brought" or contributed to the family. Would also like to see some follow up, ie: what happened after Meri jumped on all the kids last week. Did they all go home and fight it out or did they just let it drop in the parking lot

  61. So Kody talked them into Polygamy, what a shock!LOL

  62. The kids looked bored by it all. (as usual)

  63. Any good parts? Like oh, frontal lobes, etc., part that made you cringe, or were actually good? In other words, evoke any emotion from you?

  64. Anon 10:55,

    No it was pure brainwash dull talk. Like spoken all in Himalayan Monk chant. You get lulled into this sleep like state. and then your brain hurts.

  65. Mister Sister Blog, I agree with commenter Pls Use a Name that people on the blog need to be civil with each other at least. One of the anonymous posters, who posted between 2 and 2:30 today, is an offender. Unless the posters practice some sort of respect and civility, which we all have the right to demand, you will find this blog infested by a small group with the rest of us moving on elsewhere.

  66. The guy was going to have to go into Polygamy anyway; According to the Doctrine and Covenants 132 (Joseph Smith Mormon Bible, not the Christian Bible)

    #4, if they don't go into Polygamy, they will be DAMNED!

    How weird and sad is that?

  67. Mister Sister

    Thank you for moderating this blog, and everything else you do.

    I really enjoy hearing about everyone's opinion of the Sister Wives show... especially those from people who have chosen to identify themselves with a handle of some sort. Can you please do something about those that don't?

  68. Wow...this quickly turned into a gripe festival about user names. Maybe we can get back to the discussion at hand.

  69. Lol....that's probably why there was no "live chat" with the wives tonight on KB fb page. ISupposedly the admins werent aware of their "family night" planned for this evening. Sounds fishy to me, but what do I know since I stay burrowed in the ground...hehe

  70. It really doesn't make any difference whether people post under anonymous or give themselves a name, it's not like they couldn't just keep changing names every time they post.

    As with all internet discussion forums, I've learned it's best to grow a thick skin and ignore what you don't like. just my opinion, for what it is worth.

  71. To anonymous who said " they don't Believe in the Law of Placement, and don't believe in the Adam-God Doctrine. The Brown are Independent Fundamentalist Mormons.I really should stop wasting my time on this blog.
    November 6, 2011 2:01 PM

    Anonymous, I think you need to study your subject a little more. "Independent Fundamentalists" are unaffiliated. That means they do not belong to any group. BUT the Browns belong to AUB, so they are not Independents. In addition AUB most definitely does believe in the Adam God doctrine - it's an important part of their belief system which they believe the mainstream LDS abandoned when they gave up polygamy.

  72. Hear! Hear! Wendy.

    However, in the interests of mitigating confusion about who's saying what, when; attempting to make everyone happy (ha-ha); and showing good faith on my part; I will adopt a username that I will try not to forget to use and I will not change.

    Keep in mind though, I cannot guarantee that someone else wishing to comment on this site, will not make the wise-ass decision to steal it from me, at some point. :*)

  73. I don't care if someone wants to comment anonymously.

    So let's get back on topic and start discussing the show.


  74. Agree with many of the above that whole Warren jeff's sermon was totally unnecessary and the kids appeared totally bored..regarding the former female neighbor, found it interesting that she couldn't come up with a positive about having sister wives even though she said she had been raised in this religion and believed in the concept!!

    Was more concerned with next weeks' preview which should the Brown family traveling to Boston (kody, sister wives, and looked like some of the older kids) being involved in a Q & A session I believe at a college. immediately, texted my college student to ask if they had visited her major Boston college campus and she answered emphatically NO...just wanted to make sure my tuition money wasn't helping fund another Brown vacation.

    And wasn't it nice to see this perpetually unemployed group enjoying a nice dinner cruise with their friends..two weeks ago weren't they whining about money being tight? They should have bought Janelle some hubcaps instead!

    Bring it on Cynical Jinx..can't wait for that review!

  75. Tonight I had to keep switching channels back and forth from Grifter Wives to The Walking Dead...the zombies were more real than the Brown Family so they won! I did see the preview of the Boston visit- must not have gone well because I live in Boston and no one seemed to noticed them!

  76. Kody looked like he didn't understand what his friend was saying tonite about the consequences of adding another wife to his marriage. It seemed none of the Browns really addressed the man's concerns about how adding another wife would affect his wife he has now. Just another episode of let's just bypass the real issues about plural marriage.

    One statement Kody said that really pissed me off was when he mentioned how the mothers in the FLDS could just let their daughters get married so young. Ah Kody, maybe you haven't been keeping up with what's been going in the FLDS, but the mothers don't have a say in anything. Guess he hasn't heard that if the mothers refuse to have their daughters married, they could have all their children taken away. Besides, aren't the men suppose to be the priesthood head in the families? Why aren't you making a comment about the fathers? They are the ones that are using the young girls as pawns in their sick game of power and planets.

  77. WOW! Hunter is playing football now and is getting back to his old self?!

    Wait... Kody.. weren't YOU the one who suggested football to Hunter? Imagine that!! You were RIGHT Kody - football was all your depressed/confused son needed. It seems to have solved all the issues! And we have Kody to thank for his invaluable parenting skills.

    (In case you can't get my tone, I'm being 100% sarcastic)

  78. They do not loose their kids. It IS a Mothers (AND Fathers) job to protect their kids.

    Cynical, you shouldn't be an Admin if you insist on being so rude all the time.

  79. I was REALLY upset by Meri's advice to the visiting couple, with reference to polygamy - "You just have to jump in with both feet! Close your eyes, plug your nose, and jump in!"

    :0 Close your eyes? Plug your nose? Jump in?! Is she actually trying to say that the "decision" of turning the worlds of 6 children upside down, sharing your husband with another woman and completely decimating any semblance to a stable monogamous family is something you just have to shut out all senses to and jump in?

    I'm sorry Meri. That was so wrong. SO wrong. The fact that the only way a human being can bring themselves to "do this lifestyle" is by jumping in with eyes closed and breath held speaks volumes about how misguided the "religion" is.

    I really hope that couple finds the strength to listen to that inner voice so clearly crying out that polygamy is absolutely detrimental and no loving god could require it as a means to salvation.

  80. In the FLDS, one can, in fact, have their children taken away if they don't behave according to the dictates of the grand poobah.

    I agree with ModernWife as to Meri. She seems to be getting dumber with each episode. I felt very sorry for the visiting wife.

    "God's number is J-E-S-U-S?" I am a devout person, but couldn't help but laugh.

  81. ModernWife, what you say is spot on!

  82. ModernWife,

    Sadly I think Kody succeeded in brainwashing that man. His poor wife and their children are going to have to go along for the ride now.

    I was watching that man's face during Kody's sermon and he seems convinced now. I HATE how they put that wife in that position to give answer as to WHY another wife might be good. She looked miserable and taken aback. It's almost as if The Brown wives were shunning her.

  83. Cry Me a Robyn RiverNovember 7, 2011 at 10:16 AM

    when Robyn asked the Nicole friend didn't the aspect of having a sister wife appeal to her, i thought Nicole was going to answer, "no, not if i get one like you!" HAH!!

  84. Dinah54, the FLDS teaching and preferences DO NOT OUTWEIGH the laws in this country which protect parental rights.

  85. Free and clear- I think you need to study the subject more. I am AUB, are you? I think I have a better idea than you.

  86. the wives and the kids all look bored outta their gourds whenever Kody starts his deep thoughts preaching.

    and why did they all act like that's the first time they've ever sung a well-known church hymn together? that hymn's played ALL THE TIME in all branches of mormonism including mainstream lds.

    one more thing - ALL THOSE KIDS and they don't own a piano or have a child that can play? that' SO un-mormon!!

  87. Anonymous AUB member, in several books I've read on the subject, it happens all the time. I think I'll go with those first-hand accounts rather than an anonymous person on a message board. And what about the lost boys? They are often ousted before they reach the age of majority. That would be considered child neglect, if not abuse, by most people, yet they get away with it.

    Interesting that you mention LAWS yet belong to a church that disobeys them with regard to polygamy.

  88. Anonymous AUB member:

    I'm stoked to see that an AUB member is posting on this site.

    My question is PURELY out of curiosity and in no way (I swear!) am I trying to be rude - this is something I've always wanted to know:

    From what I understand, polygamists believe that plural marriage is a means to achieve the highest level of exultation in an afterlife. I assume, that God (in AUB opinion) would desire for all his children to be able to achieve this. If God created humankind to reproduce pretty much at a 50/50 between male and female genders, how can multiple wives be what God intended for his children?

  89. Polygamy - What Love is This? is a tv program from SLC that you can watch online. it showcases various sects of polygamy that women have escasped from. and none of them are a pretty picture of polygamy.

    they're all abusive and degrading to women and a spirit killer. the women were all just surviving and didn't even know it fully until they got out and for the first time in their lives could start living life.

  90. That last comment was me!! I accidentally used my first name instead of blog name :)

    Cheryl = ModernWife

    For future reference if I make the same mistake

  91. I'd like to see the Browns go much further than simply criticizing the FLDS folks for not stopping Jeffs. One reason Jeffs was able to command so much loyalty is that he illegally exercised an awesome amount of control over his followers' lives. Opposing Jeffs meant losing everything. He should not have had that much control. He did and his fellow FLDS leaders still do - because the Utah justice system does nothing to stop them.

    The Browns could use their platform to call out the Utah justice system for doing nothing to protect victims of religiously-inspired and religiously-MANDATED abuse in the FLDS and other groups.

    The Utah Supreme Court came right out and stated that the Elissa Walls jury might have found Jeffs innocent if they had been instructed to consider whether he *intended for 14-year-old Elissa to be raped when he ordered her to a) marry and b) "go home and submit to" her 19-year-old husband - and for that they overturned the only conviction Utah had been able to secure against him. (What exactly might the jury have concluded he intended instead? Four years of evening prayer sessions - until she came of age and decided she was ready?)

    Next up is the judge-mandated suppression of the tapes on which Jeff can be heard raping one of his 12-year-old "brides" in front of witnesses. That was sealed out of concern for protecting Jeffs "religious freedom". And then, of course, there is the same judge actively trying to ensure the FLDS retains control over the UEP trust in spite of mountains of evidence of abuse by the FLDS leadership both of the trust itself - and of members through manipulation of trust assets.

    The root problem is a justice system (likely backed by powerful political forces) that is corrupted by a stunning preference for protecting the religious freedom of leaders no matter how despicable, corrupt or abusive. Read the Utah Supreme Courts' decision in the Elissa Wall's case. There is no detectible concern for her well being or the massive injustice she suffered - other than some obligatory language about "regretting" any pain she might feel as a result of the ruling.

    Unless there is some public outcry *in Utah* against a top-down system that is rigged against justice for victims, nothing will change. Kody has a nice platform and the ear of folks who are in a position to make a difference. I'd like to see him use it!

    There is a reason it took Texas to stop Jeffs. Too many Utah judges would clearly prefer to see him stay in power than see their own priesthood powers challenged - no matter what the cost to his victims.

    If Kody wants to promote the cause of polygamy - let him first fight for a justice system that would hold men like WSJ - and abuse-prone members in any religious group (including his own) - in check.

  92. Cheryl, I appreciate your question. I was pretty aggravated in my post at 10:56. I meant to specify that I am former AUB. And, I'm former for many reasons. All of those reasons are based on the fact I could not see logic with MOST of AUB, LDS, FLDS theology, and your question highlights many disagreements I have with the religion. None of it had to do with growing up in a polygamist family or feeling neglected or ostracized. I was always encouraged by my mothers and father to explor and grow and find my own footing spiritually. I am troubled by the negativity that is out there regarding Polygamist culture.
    There are sickle like Jeffs, but ultimately, I think he was a perverted power hog who whose the faith based on his own goals. The Brown are what I would concider typical in the polygamist faith. Most young families are well balanced and loving. I will say this was not the case twenty years ago-but men and women are more modern and I believe the face of plural marriage has changed from when my grandparents practiced 40 years ago.

    Today I concider myself agnostic. I have close ties to all my siblings and parents and extended families, as do my kids. We celebrate holidays together and visit frequently.

  93. ...and to piggy back onto Cheryl/ModernWife's question to the anonymous AUB member...if each man is sealed for eternity with his wives and children, how would that work since those children are going to grow up and marry and have children of their own. Wouldn't the man's female children be sealed to their husbands and, thereby, live for all eternity with their husbands on their own planet? The same holding true for the male children since I would assume they would get their own kingdom to reign over and not be stuck on their dad's?

  94. As a follow-up:

    The argument that FLDS members choose to cede control over their lives to their prophet does not hold up for the following reasons:

    Children born into that system are taught that the outside world is evil and that their "choice" is between living with family or being cast out into the outside world and destroyed. That doesn't exactly qualify as a choice. That level of coercion would invalidate most legal contracts.

    Now consider that the control they are asked to surrender includes such fundamentals as who they will marry and at what age. Where to live. Where to work and what to do with their wages. How many children to have. How to raise those children - including when to abandon an underage son - or surrender a 12-year-old daughter for an unwanted marriage to an old man. If the prophet says "take your 11-year-old son out of school and send to him work on a construction job - they have to comply - and so does the kid.

    It is an insidious power structure that only survives because their is no political will to stop it. The legal violations are numerous and clear. Texas proved they can be successfully litigated.

    Polygamy is absolutely tied up in this mess - because the FLDS leadership assigns wives to men and can reassign them as will if the men lose favor. Since women have to produce as many children as possible, they are completely dependent on the system. Men live in fear of losing everything if they step out of line. Without polygamy - people would have more control over their own lives. They would be less likely to have unsustainable families - and so could conceivably start over somewhere else on their own. As it stands, how does a household of 50 living in an FLDS-controled home and generating income from an FLDS-owned business decide to make a change?

    Fight the political and legal structures that are currently enabling horrendous abuse. Once everyone has access to equal and genuine protection under the law, then we can talk about whether polygamy itself is an issue.

  95. Responding to whoever stated that Kody should be demanding Utah law enforcement do something about the FLDS abusive system. uhhmm...... i don't think Kody is in ANY position as a lawbreaker himself to be directing the cops to go arrest someone else. lol

  96. The anonymous person posting at 1:27 is not me. Just wanted to clarify.

    Former AUB

  97. adding to Mono and Cheryl/Modern: the additional problem regarding polygamy, when I hear Kody and co. say this isn't for everyone, thus "solving" the problem of the obvious imbalance of the 50/50 male to female ratio in nature which isn't compatible with polygamy, their religions dogma is in essence creating a hierarchy on earth and "in heaven", because in their view this is a superior way of family life that god has commanded them to live. So those who don't live it are a lower caste, feel inferior, from what I saw in their friends facial expressions..... So it seems stressful to live this way, and stressful NOT to live this way

  98. Boy, Cynical, this one was tough to sit all the way through.

    Kody is just a moral beacon, a martyr, spiritual advisor, the leader of the church, and the savior for all those lost prarie girls! YAY! Must be exhausting. You asked for church, and you got it. Ouch.

    "Cap in hand" my foot.

    These women are all beaten down at this point. To hear them try to defend it all was deeply sad. I just wanted to hug poor Janelle.

  99. ...also, isn't it bad for the gene pool to have the genes of just a few men in a society? If no one converts to their religion, they eventually all become related really fast. As Flora Jessop said: "they don't have family trees, they have family wreaths" (ps. I am Anonymous from 3:13)

  100. 'Jerrie' sounds like Flora Jessop. I read her book and how that post was is exactly the same. Sensible, straight forward and to the point with facts to back it up.
    All polygamous societies HAVE to be abusive because the basic rules are the man is always in charge and women should have as many children as possible. These two things put women at a disadvatage, as does the 'young' marriage thing (underage or not) because by the time they can think for themselves, they have a few kids in tow. I love this blog and great to see a former AUB member posting but I hate how all the interesting stuff happens while I am asleep down here in Australia! lol

  101. I said it last week and I'll say it again..Kody & wives need to start chugging those detox drinks they are peddling. They are toxic with a capital "T"! Yuck....

  102. Have you tried it? I've never had any of their products. My Dr. told me that a colon cleanze actually destroys all the good bacteria as well as bad.... and wasn't good for you.

  103. This is in answer to Anonymous who " said...
    Free and clear- I think you need to study the subject more. I am AUB, are you? I think I have a better idea than you."

    I don't want this to turn into a silly "I know more than you do" situation - however. I am ex AUB, ex plural wife, and was a member of AUB for decades. I was also considered to be quite a doctrinarian, so I am speaking from knowledge, not speculation. It's hard to know who is who, with all the people who post as "Anonymous," but if you are the one who said that AUB does not believe in the Adam God doctrine, I am 100% certain that you are wrong. I had enough discussions on the subject, including with AUB Council Members, to know that this is an integral doctrine, particularly in the context of the temple ordinances. If Troy Bowles sees this post I know that he will back me up on this. He is also ex AUB.

  104. "I think I have a better idea than you."

    You may disagree with someone, however, you do not need to insult them. Simply put - I have a different theory on that, or I see it differently, but do not put down another commenter. Otherwise, your post will be deleted. thanks!

  105. anyone want to back me up on the sister wives fan page on facebook? This crazy LDS lady has started hurling insults at me (accusing me of sleeping around, not being able to get a man, etc).

    Her name is Melody Lariviere and here is what how the dialog went:
    Her: "Just love the real *freaks* here who bitch endlessly yet pretend they aren't watching and drooling/gobbling up every detail of every episode. Kody is just one more man in America with one wife, one legitimate child and a group of girlfriends with whom he has a bunch of illegitimate children. The only difference is he is not lying about it and is now making money by being on TV which is burning more than a few jealous asses here on board. How many of you cohabited with someone without benefit of marriage? Just as I thought---you are no no better than Kody!!!"

    me-Geeze Melody, assuming that people who don't approve of the Brown's lifestyle have been cohabitators themselves? That is faulty logic and quite frankly, absurd.

    "What's up, Tammy, did I touch a raw nerve somewhere? Could it be you've been in far more pants than Kody and all the wives combined and maybe shacked up with someone now , that is, if any real man on this earth could stomach your mouth?"

    and on a different topic where someone asked about what bible the browns use, she says this to me:

    "Tammy-get a life-you can't make my choices with your endless know it all babble about topics you know nothing about. I will continue to let people know there are NO branches or "offshoots" of the Mormon (LDS) faith."

    --I just can not believe that she would act like that. She is making LDS people look like absolute snot-faced jerks. If any of you are LDS would you go tell her to shut up and quit making the rest of you look bad? Surely this kind of name calling is not condoned by the elders and prophets.

  106. Tammy, you do know that you can control what sites you visit, right?

    Cynical, where's the review??!!?? You are the best!

  107. Sure do Goji. :) I just wish that on facebook's sister wives site people were free to express feelings and thoughts about the show without being called b--ches and sluts. Like this blog, we can talk about the show but not pick at each other.

    I was simply asking for back up because someone on the facebook page was turning into quite a bully, accusing me of sleeping with many people, etc.

    Guess I won't get the back up. That is okay. I'm used to having to go it alone.

  108. Honey, most of us are not signed up for that page, or we would!

    They upset me because they are SO nasty! I love it here because you can have an opinion, and you can do it and be respectful. LOVE it here!

    I would back you up - but they probably wouldn't accept me!

    And, people come at different ties of the day. I would simply put a reminder up that if anyone is on facebook Sister Wives, you need to talk to them!

    Hope all works out!

  109. ^You are sweet, thank you.

    I am not signed up as a "liker" on the sister wives page. You don't have to "like" pages in order to comment on them now, a recent change facebook made. ;)

    This is a great blog, I agree. I like it here.

  110. Tammi what page is it?

  111. http://www.facebook.com/sisterwives

    You have to click "everyone" to see people's comments besides just what SW comments. And then you can scroll around and see comments.

    I think this link will work to take you to the specific one where she accuses me of sleeping around.

  112. Tammy - just checked that link. So sorry that you were exposed to such vulgar insults. The administrators here would never let such nastiness be posted.

  113. Backup-check ((smiling))

  114. Tammy - let me get this straight. you said you liked this site cause we can say what we want about the show but not pick at each other. Yet you're asking for reinforcements from here to go to a PRO-FAN site and pick back at a certain lady that you're in a personal fight with. That makes perfect sense!! lol

    it seems to be a very easy decision to just stay away from a pro-fan site, since you're obviously not one. Just sayin'...

  115. It is not a pro-fan site. There are varying opinions on the site. It is ran by TLC but not everyone there seems to agree with KBF. It is a site to discuss the show. There IS a SW site that is just for fans, i am not a part of it.

    Not encouraging a mean girls group at all, don't want us to stoop to her level of name calling and vulgar accusations!
    Just thought we were kind of a community here and if someone were calling you a whore just because you disagree with polygamy or accidentally called AUB a "branch" of mormonism...well I'd have your back and stick up for you.

    Guess the feelings aren't mutual. :(

    Sorry. Forget it. I'm done talking to her anyway, it just really bothered me to be accused of such vile things.

    Thanks to those who did stand up for me. Whoever McNutt is, she wrote you back and asked if you were my lover. ha.

    I would think our LDS readers would want to tell her to knock it off, she's certainly making the religion look bad. My mormon friends aren't like her at ALL. I don't know what gives?

    Anyway, moving on. I'm looking forward to the review/recap of last night's episode. The writers here always have some good humor and insights.

  116. Wow. You guys are kind of attacking Tammi. For as much as you all tout that this is a nice site that doesn't attack, I find this super ironic. Most of my comments get deleted on this site just because I may not agree. My gripe is that no one should be intentionally rude or demeaning but--thicker skins perhaps? I find a few comment police on here...

    Tammi, that was me! Ha ha! She really was a pissy pants.

    You responded with patience lady!

  117. Let's move on please. Tammy deserves respect, not mocking here. Let's just stay here and enjoy our site.
    I hate they were stupid over there, but let's just calm down and move ahead here. Thanks.

  118. Ok, i went and looked at it. The original post IS TIED AND RESPONDING DIRECTLY TO THE SISTER WIVES FAN site! did you two really not notice that? so, that's the problem. of course, it's going to invite retaliation from them!

    And I read all the comments. The whole thing is sounding like a high school girls fight. Enjoy if that's your thing!

    But i agree with Tammy, it's time to end it here and move on. ;')

  119. We find it funny that our comments about their financial situation have been removed. So, we will ask again is there anyone of them have a job yet? How are they supporting themselves?

    Also, there was an excellent opportunity tonight for them to sing the praises of their lifestyle but when they were asked to articulate all of the advantages of having SW's not one of them could tell their guest what was good about it. Meri saying you have to live it to know the benefits was a cop out and they should have been able to offer thousands of benefits if there are any.

  120. I don't know anon 11:27. Some things are hard to describe. I really believe the parents feel they are doing the right thing. Isn't that what we all do? Follow our own bliss?

  121. Whats up Tammy?
    I find it ironic for someone, esp a KB fan, to call U a slut or whore esp if they know nothing about U...now the irony is them defending KB, bc technically he's a MAN WHORE...lol
    Whats worse, is him & his cult tryna justify it all in name of religion, blah, blah, blah :/

  122. "Owen Allred is perhaps best known for his outspoken criticism of child abuse and marriages of girls under the age of 18."
    I hardly think he is best known for this. He may have spoken out later when things started looking really bad in public about the problem, but plenty of underage marriages went on under his watch. He didn't oppose them until the AUB found it expedient to take the "good polygamists" approach. I knew of quite a few girls who were married as young as 15 under Owen Allred.

    "He publicly denounced the child abuse that occurred in many polygamist groups and encouraged members of the AUB to report such activities to law enforcement officials. Additionally, he campaigned for the legal marriage age in Utah to be raised from 14 to 16, noting that AUB members are forbidden to engage in any courtship before the age of 17."
    In the mean time, he was an accomlice to the theft of 1.5 million dollars. He and other AUB leaders lost that battle in court and the AUB were saddled with a 6.5 million dollar fine. They scrounged it up.

    "You guys really should stop assuming you know what Christine's family beliefs are."
    It's hard to say what their individual beliefs are, but I know what they are supporting and a little about what they're not reporting about their group's activities. I can't explain what they believe, but I can explain what gets taught in the AUB.

  123. Please...explain away!

  124. Dear Troy Bowles,
    i, for one, want to thank you so very much for explaining these things to us, and hope you will tell us more.
    For one thing, I want to know what the AUB is like. I don't want to guess. You are a great teacher. Please do explain all the ins and outs of it to us, so that we have a understanding of what the heck they are all about, without just hoping we understand it, but hearing the truth. Please come tell us more anytime you have the time. I know we all anticipate your posts. Thank you so very much!

  125. Me too! Does the AUB wear the underwear?

  126. I'll start with the Adam-God doctrine, since I saw that one come up.

    Yes indeed, in the AUB, they believe that the being they address as "Heavenly Father" was once the individual Adam, the first man in the Bible. Prior to that, he was the Messiah in a previous mortal world. We don't know what his name was then, since that's too sacred, but in that world, as a Messiah figure, his father played the role of Adam.

    And so it is today. Michael is the name of the being who, previously having played the Christ, earned the right to start this world, spiritually and genetically. While he was playing the role of Adam in a temporary mortal state, the being he worshiped as god was his own father, who had played the "Adam" figure in the last world. When Michael descended to take up temporary mortal status, he took with him Eve, who was one of his wives. Michael was returned to godhood status after he experienced death as Adam, at age 930. Then, as Michael, he sent another one of his wives, the Virgin Mary, to take up temporary mortal status. She gave birth to Jesus, who hadn't experienced the mortal world yet, but was Michael's favorite spirit child, especially after Jesus had advocated saving humankind through freedom, while his brother Satan wanted to do it through force. Their father, who fundamentalists know as "Jehovah," chose Jesus to be the Messiah in this world because of his method. Jehovah literally commanded Satan to go to Hell at this point, and Satan had to comply, but he wreaks havoc on the world from there.

    In the end, Satan will lose all power and this world will be resurrected. At that point, Jesus Christ will repeat the pattern and take up temporary mortality so that he can start the human population in yet another new world. Righteous Mormon fundamentalists from this world will go on to produce spirit children into eternity. Those spirit children will enter human bodies in the next world, where the being we know as Jesus Christ will be known as "Heavenly Father." He'll have his own favorite son, who will serve the purpose of Messiah in that world.

    And so it goes. They call it the Grand Order of Saviors. I call it Mormon fundamentalist theology 101.

  127. As we can see, this Mormon fundamentalist theology is completely polytheistic. According to the belief, the number of gods is infinite. But only the most special ones of all can participate in the Grand Order of Saviors. Ordinary human beings can only aspire to lesser godhood, subordinate to the being we call Jesus as well as Heavenly Father, who are distinctly different beings.

    Above Jehovah is an infinite council of gods called Elohim, which is a title they interpret to just mean "gods."

  128. AUB members wear garments underneath their outer clothing. They are the long style from the Nineteenth Century and go all the way to the wrist and ankle. They are tied up the front with square-knots, as opposed to the simple pullover style the LDS members wear today. There's also a special collar that is distinctive to the long version.

    Among the AUB, they are very conscious about their garments being visible through their clothing, so they tend to wear long sleeves and thick layers. This is different from LDS members, whose garments are easy to spot under their other clothing. Fundamentalists are uncomfortable with this.

  129. Sacrament is administered a bit differently from the LDS Church to the AUB. In the LDS Church, it comes as the familiar Wonder bread, torn to small pieces by hand, followed by the water, which is served in tiny individual cups. For the fundamentalists, it's a bit different.

    When I left the AUB, it was standard practice to use homemade bread and water was served in huge, 1-liter glasses. Each person takes a sip from one of these huge glasses, from which 30-40 people have placed their lips. Inevitably, bread crumbs were floating when the water level approached the bottom of the glass. This was highly unsanitary and I've seen hepatitis ravage communities that do it this way. At times in the AUB, they would have to cancel meetings for several weeks. Some people refused to stay home if they had hepatitis. Instead, they wanted to make certain they didn't miss the sacrament, as they thought it would help heal them.

  130. I think Pilio.... is correct when saying that Kody was successful in brainwashing the couple, bc although the wives werent available for "live chat" Sunday night, Andy & Nicole(mostly her) were available on KB fb pge for live chat & yep, they're pursuing adultery, I meant polygamy...lol
    Also, not sure if everyone on that page was wathing the same episode as us bc they were all gushing that this was the best episode ever!!
    I know right?....hahahahaha

  131. Troy, thank you so much for helping us out here!

    ***To those that can't read or get the drift of our rules here, I must repeat this AGAIN. (sigh)




  132. Mizkylie
    Troy is extremely qualified bc he is former AUB, which U would know if U would take the time & read thru the blog.
    Now, if u think this blog is such a bad, negative, nasty site, then why are U here??
    Go back to the excessive sugar coated KB fb page, bc here we enjoy challenging & stimulating isights & opinions(WHICH WE ARE ENTITLED TO...) that people offer! Also, there are plenty other sites that spews negative & differences of opinions!! J

  133. Caramel Brownie, it made me upset too, but if you look, gone. I guess some don't understand the rules of respectability on here.

  134. Yep, Heather, I just realized that..lol
    Seriously, she should be well aware of the blog rules, bc the sugar coated site has them too! Basically, if ur not all "goo goo gaw gaw" Browns, then ur comment will be deleted off the other site,
    Hell their admins go as far as "closing(blocking everyone) the wall", so no one can post if theyre not available to "guard" it...lol They say its for security reasons, but I call BS again, on that one...

  135. Troy, PLEASE tell us more. I find it fascinating and amazing. Amazing so many believe it, I guess.

  136. Caramel, that you know who also sells LIV. Imagine that LOL.

  137. As my dad used to say: One bad apple don't spoil the bunch!

    All of us that work on the blog are very grateful to MANY of you that come here and make this blog what it is!

    The whole point of this blog is freedom of choice.


    If you are pro or con Brown we don't care, as long as you present your thoughts in a respectable way, do not make fun of others, and don't name call.

    That's not an unreasonable request in my book.

    We've been very blessed with great folks on here, I hate to even put that warning on again, but some folks don't get the just of being able to disagree in a respectable way.

    If you see something ignorant like that again, don't worry, we will catch it. THANK YOU ALL for making this one great blog!

  138. It's sad when you wake up at 1:15 in the morning, and you slip in your LR to see if the SWB has been updated! I'm hooked! THANKS for this blog.
    Cynical Jinx, I can't WAIT to see what you made out of this week.

  139. Lol Anony....guess she needs to consume more of her products bc she seems toxic & well her manners just don't seem very humanitaran like....LOL

  140. Looks lIke I missed out on the fun! - was it our "I know more than everyone else' who got deleted, and was she offended by Troy? What a surprise! : )

  141. I guess I missed out on the fun when someone got upset.

    About name-calling and other childish debate habits, let's not get into it. If I insult someone's intelligence, I'm going to extract a piece of brain matter in the process and it will hurt. Let's not even go there. People who make it personal will find themselves a laughingstock in a very quick way.

    If you want to insult me, go to cosmophilosophy.blogspot.com. I won't delete you. You'll be in my trap and I'll have my way with you.

  142. About the Adam-God doctrine:

    "No. The doctrine remains very contavercial with the AUB. Some extreme FLDS still believe this bizaar theology, but mainstream LDS rejected it in the late 1800's. This was one of many points that lead members to split off and form the new Bretheren."
    Tell me you're not using evidence of the actions of the LDS Church to prove something about the AUB. If you don't realize that the AUB and the LDS Church are on diverging paths over this issue, you're not
    qualified to discuss it.

    The Adam-God doctrine is one of the deal-breakers. People who call the doctrine "controversial" are usually bearing the title "LDS." In the AUB, it's accepted doctrine. Look at the Journal of Discourses, volume 1, Page 50 and read what Brigham Young said about it. That's the AUB take on the matter.

  143. "The Brown are Independent Fundamentalist Mormons."
    This is the first time I've heard someone call them Independents. Some members in the AUB should be glad to hear it.

    "I really should stop wasting my time on this blog."
    I can't imagine responding to a blog that makes me feel that way, yet you do it.

  144. I'd like to point out that Rulon Allred, Owen's brother who was murdered in 1977, routinely allowed underage marriages. Rulon even married two girls who were 15. They were twins.

  145. Troy Bowles - thanks for answering my several questions i posted to you on the other thread. Appreciate your time and energy and educational answers. God Bless You my good man!

  146. You're very welcome. I'll answer any questions I can.

  147. thanks for your blogspot link, Troy. I agree that Flora Jessop's CHURCH OF LIES book is excellent for a beginning read in understanding polygamy and the entrapment of the women in it.

    Do you know the Doris lady that has the SLC tv show, Polygamy - What Love is This? i love her guests and callers on that show. She is one classy lady, too.

  148. oops! my bad, Troy! i just read some more of your blog and saw you were actually on her show! i've got to go watch that now. thanks!

    also, LOVE your take on the Dargers. i wasn't feeling any different watching them on talk shows than i did with the Browns. Darger himself comes across as a very stern, no-nonsense taskmaster ( which of course, is the opposite of Kody but then Darger controls the purse strings which Kody does not.) And who knows what would all be exposed about them if they had a reality show?

    anyway, off to watch you on Doris's show and again, i'm going to enjoy reading your blog! ❤

  149. yay troy is here!

    My question for you...
    Do you see any of the sister wives as potentially leaving? Janelle wasn't raised in it, is there hope for her? You know what I mean? Is there hope for any of them to escape or to you do they all seem too far deep in?

  150. giggling!!!!
    Troy, I said you reminded me of my brother for some reason, and you sure do - he is exactly the same with his passions!

    ""If you want to insult me, go to cosmophilosophy.blogspot.com. I won't delete you. You'll be in my trap and I'll have my way with you.""

    There, my friends is a VERY intelligent man. And fair in his speech. I want this guy on my team in any intellectual battles.

  151. Bargain Babe, I think the Browns are pretty dysfunctional. I'd be amazed if they all stayed together. But to be totally honest, I can hardly stand watching the show. It's just a joke with no real substance behind it. So I don't know their personalities well enough to be able to guess who will be the first to defect.

  152. Even though I don’t think they set out to do this show with the intentions to change the world and laws as they are. That seems to be the direction they have been thrusted into. They just wanted to expose their lives to the public, in hopes of receiving basic understanding and acceptance of their lifestyle. Not only for themselves, but to maybe make things easier for their children in the future. I think they definitely accomplished showing the public, at least me, there is a whole other side to the polygamist lifestyle, that I was never aware of. A positive side. Who knew! I, along with many other viewers I suspect. Viewed the world of polygamy in solely a negative light. When I used to think of “polygamy”, I immediately associated it with “child molestation, the demeaning of women, etc”, aka “Warren Jeffs”. Until the Browns opened up their lives to the public, all I knew of was the negative con-donations associated with polygamy. As far as I’m concerned, the Brown family have been successful in changing many peoples views & opinions on what a polygamist family entails.
    The Browns stated at the beginning they were doing the show because their lifestyle has always been kept in such a hush hush, secretive society. As a result of this, the majority of mainstream society has automatically assumed this was due to the fact that it IS such tawdry lifestyle. It was assumed that this lifestyle bordered on abuse so prevalently, that it must be kept under wraps. Because if exposed, they would be surely persecuted by not only the public, but with-in the court system as well.

  153. Here’s how I see things, put simply & clearly. The public have only seen ONE side of polygamy portrayed. Threw the media mainly. And up until now, it was ALWAYS in a VERY negative light. For so many years now, through no fault of our own, we’ve all had preconceived notions about the polygamist lifestyle. So between how secretive these communities have always been (turns out with GOOD reason). Coupled with the sensational media stories that have all watched in horror. The public has never had anything else to go on. Until now that is.
    I suspect there are many other families like the Browns out there in hiding as well. After they’v seen what the Browns have gone through as a result of “coming out”, I sure they’l remain in hiding until this country not only catches up, but opens up their minds to it all. I’v seen nothing but a positive, stable, loving, respectful, God fearing family on the show. The Brows family hold the kind of religious, kinship, and marriage values, that are quite frankly harder & harder to find with-in todays “typical” main-stream families.
    It’s sad to me that despite showing us all these positive, even REFRESHING, family values the last few seasons. They were all persecuted anyways. Forced to flee from their home, or run the risk of God only knows what kind persecution. And for what? For standing up and saying “This is who we are, and what we're about. Please just accept us." ? They NEVER pushed or even alluded that WE should live as they do. On the contrary. All’s they asked is that WE, allow THEM to live as they do, peacefully. A pretty simple request I think. Some would even say, it’s their constitutional right to do so. Sadly it has proven to be ANYTHING but simple for them.
    Am I the only one that has a problem with this family being run out of town like they were? It was reminiscent of the torch & pitch forks days! Why can’t people see this is SO WRONG and SO UNCONSTITUTIONAL. Why aren’t more people outraged & demanding that these people be given their rights back. We have freedom of choice, speech and religion in this country, remember?! They even showed how careful they were as to not to violate any insurance or tax laws, or anything else to that nature already. The police or any other legal entities shouldn’t of bothered this family at all! PERIOD! It’s ironic that THEY respected the laws & rules having to do with taxes, insurance & legal marriage rules/ laws. Yet the law never seemed to give them a chance to explain or to prove to them, that they were all in compliance.
    All’s the Browns have done is ask that we open our minds & challenge us to rid ourselves of our pre-conceived notions about their type of family. To simply watch & hopefully learn. THEN decide.They showed us this whole other side, that was not at all like what I have always pictured
    . I think that the biggest problem with the general public that have actually opened their minds while watching the show is this. They simply can’t wrap their heads around the fact, that they had it ALL wrong to begin with! It’s an especially hard pill to swallow, for those of us who pride ourselves on being so damn politically correct & “open minded” to begin with. With-in the Browns family life, lies your truth. They are the PROOF that we DID, in deed have it all wrong. They’v proven to me anyways that there is in fact this whole other version of a polygamist family that resides in our country. A version that is NOT AT ALL like the Jeff’s version. What we have all been taught and thought was the norm with-in this particular society, simply isn’t correct . I not only suspect, but am convinced, that the type of polygamist family that the Browns are, is the real “norm" in polygamy. What a revelation huh?! Norm or not, as Americans, they deserve our acceptance & most of all, seem to need our help. .