Discussion Time!
Here we have the Browns. They are 5 adults, who are all of age. Robin is in her 30s at the time she chose to join this polyamorous marriage. The other wives were in their early 20s when they decided to join the relationship. So yeah, maybe they were young, but certainly old enough to know their own mind.
The wives openly admit to struggling with jealousy and bitterness and anger and all those feelings that everyone wishes they could rise above. Meri stated in the first season that working through negative feelings makes them a better person. Polygamy is their “normal” and they try to grow and thrive just like everyone else.
I like to think I’m a live and let live kind of person. I don’t think I could do it, and I think a religion that dictates it is misogynistic and damaging to women. In modern society it just seems odd to me. Honestly, so long as there’s no abuse, and no fraud, I see nothing wrong with it. I don't see any legal reason for there to be more than 2 people in a marriage though.
So, to take the AUB at face value and assume that everything is love and light and no one is excommunicated and no one has children they can’t afford and no fraud is committed and no abuse is permitted and everyone is happy…then, my curiosity is piqued. Other than religious reasons, what are your objections to polygamists like the Browns? (To repeat: I don’t mean the creepy, sign-14-year-old-girls-over-
Thank you Maraschino5~~
I didn't have a objection until I learned of the religion. I know of some that do it, in a weird nice way, a couple of women in a relationship with an older man. they don't sleep together often, it's more companionship.
ReplyDeleteI don't know enough of their belief system to make much of a statement, but from the way they appear to make it work, it doesn't seem AS BAD as some of the others. He seems to genuinely care for his wives, the kids seem fairly normal and loved...I mean, it is against the law. But it seems like there are bigger fish to fry, so to speak, out there.
ReplyDeleteBut, if they are abusing the system, or their family members, then it's a problem.
I don't want to share my man, period. i love my best friends, but, I want my man in bed with me at night. Just to be there. period.
ReplyDeleteIf you could get past the jealousy, it might be nice. this is, of course, if you were the first wife and got to help pick any others. I would say 3 at most. AND, I think the man should have a bedroom of his own. Come on, do you think Kody has sex every day of the week? AND, if children weren't involved. Maybe for older couples, or with children that have moved on.
ReplyDeleteIf not for the religious objections, I really don't have a problem with it. I do suppose it makes for some interesting discussions with children. I can't imagine that there's no jealousy, not for a minute. For a large group like the Browns, it's a joke to think any of those kids get any "father" time. This could be very damaging. We feel bad for divorced parents that don't see their kids everyday, yet, every other weekend of DAD would be a treat for the Browns. If one chooses polygamy, they defiantly shouldn't have a large family.
ReplyDeleteI say go for it, if that's what you want! Just don't push it on your kids. Or have them call the other mom mom
ReplyDeleteI personally don't care if someone engages in polygamy, UNLESS :
ReplyDelete1) Coercion is involved in the polygamous marriage in ANY WAY - and I would consider compelling a first wife to participate in a polygamous marriage with another woman whom she did not want in the marriage to be coercion. Coercion could also manifest itself as compelling a female to enter a marriage as a junior wife when she did not want to do so.
2) Polygamy is not ok when it is inspired by coercive religious dogma.
Too many women are raised in religious groups which compel and brainwash a woman into "female submission" to male authority and oppression, and polygamy is a feature in many of those religions, for example, fundamentalist Islam and fundamentalist Mormonism. When a woman is raised in a cult environment which dictates that SHE MUST PARTICIPATE IN OR CONSENT TO HER HUSBAND'S POLYGAMOUS MARRIAGE OR SHE WILL BE DAMNED, THIS IS NOT CONSENT.(see Mormon Scriptures Doctrine and Covenants Section 132) THIS IS COERCION, NOT FREELY GIVEN CONSENT. CONSENT OBTAINED AS A RESULT OF COERCION OR BRAINWASHING DOES NOT REPRESENT LEGAL CONSENT.
3) Polygamy associated with underage marriage is unacceptable. According to a researcher if only 10% of the marriages in a group are polygamous the age of marriage for girls begins to plummet. Teenage girls belong in school, not in the maternity ward.
4) Polygamy involving abuse of the welfare system or fraud to support huge hordes of children and hordes of wives is simply unacceptable.
Can't afford to have more children or wives ? Don't have the kids and don't marry women you cannot support, and don't expect the public to pay for them.
If someone wants to participate in polygamy, let them choose this lifestyle freely,of their own volition, after completing their education and seeing the world, and after dating extensively. Let them choose polygamy not because they are told that they will go to hell if they don't enter polygamous marriage,let them choose polygamy because they are truly in love with a man and another woman (or women) they cannot live without. Then and only then would I not have an objection.
I always find this document interesting -
ReplyDeleteprovided courtesy of John Llewellyn -
"Selective Amnesia Regarding Polygamy : What We Must Forget:"
http://www.scribd.com/doc/49147264/Selective-Amnesia-Regarding-Adult-Consent-in-Polygamy
Men having multiple wives but women only having one partner is really unacceptable. If a man expects his wife to live with the fact that he has other women, then the women should be able to have more than one husband. Seems fair to me.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't have a problem with the religious aspects if there was some common sense thrown in, as in, God doesn't like it when you have more children than you can afford or personally care for. I feel the same way about the Quiverfull movement. If you have to have government hand-outs, use your older kids to raise the little ones, or can never give your kids anything new, it's past time to stop, whether you have one or 15.
ReplyDeleteAs for polygamy, I have no problems with it as long as spouses are consenting adults. I don't think I would choose it, but if I did, one extra wife would have been plenty. One night off, one night on would have worked for my needs and having another adult around to talk to would have been nice.
I think when the Browns were all living in one 'house' the kids as much access to Kody as the Duggar kids have to their father. The children seemed to be close to each other and none of the mother's were overwhelmed.
I think both the Duggars and the Browns are cult members. What a pity that TLC gives these people a forum.
ReplyDelete"The children seemed to be close to each other and none of the mother's were overwhelmed."
ReplyDeleteWho knows how they feel about each other or if the women are overwhelmed ? They are smiling for the cameras and the checks.
Well, it's a violation of God's Law. God made one man for one woman, and this is evident in natural law, as our sex ratio is roughly 50/50. If He wanted one man to have ten wives, He would have had a sex ratio more in line with that.
ReplyDeleteEven if one is not religious, from a secular perspective, the same analysis holds. Young men by definition must be thrown out of the community since not every man can have ten wives, due to nature.
How can a woman voluntarily consent to polygamy when they are brainwashed by the cult from birth to believe that their husband is the one who must "call them beyond the veil into heaven" after death. Without a husband / priesthood holder to call her beyond the veil, a woman may not enter heaven. She must obey him or risk her eternal life and salvation.
ReplyDelete**How can a woman voluntarily consent to polygamy when they are brainwashed by the cult from birth to believe that their husband is the one who must "call them beyond the veil into heaven" after death.**
ReplyDeleteUsing that logic, how can anyone raised in a religious home since birth voluntarily consent to follow that religion as an adult? Without that religion, that person cannot enter heaven.
I wouldn't live this way, I don't agree with their religious beliefs, but all 4 of those women have had enough exposure to the outside world to know there are other options. As for all the other AUB/FLDS/Whatever women and families, I'm sure there are many in really bad situations. However, my comments are about the Browns, what I've seen on the show, read in articles about them, and my opinions. I don't believe that they are a typical polygamist family any more than I believe the Duggars are a typical Gothardite family.
What if it were reversed? What if you could have a husband that was the business man, one that was fun and cool, one to take care of the house, one that was religious, etc.?
ReplyDeleteNysha,
ReplyDeleteYou are correct, I don't think that someone can voluntarily consent to living in coercive religious polygamy OR being a member of any religious group IF the religious group engages in threats, coercion, brainwashing, blackmail, restricting access of members to education or job training, or restricting contact of members with those outside the group. Not all religions engage in blackmail, nor do all religious teach their members that they will be damned if they exit the faith. Legally speaking, consent obtained through threats and blackmail is NOT LEGAL CONSENT.
If it weren't for the religion, I would say live and let live....but keep it to 4 kids or less.
ReplyDeleteI would have a hard time sharing. Just because I think ideally, you want to believe that what you share with your spouse is so special you'll never find it with anyone else. And the thought that that intimacy could be one bedroom away with another person must be really weird.
ReplyDeleteSo long as it is completely consensual and everyone's above age, I think I'd be ok with it, but I have a real problem with the religious aspect of it. It's misogynistic and damaging to women, and one level, I wonder if these women believe they're not worthy to have 100% of a man.
According to this article in Psychology Today, polyandry (1 wife, multiple husbands) is almost non-existent except for the few occasions where brothers share a wife. However, 83% of the world practices polygyny (1 husband, multiple wives) and only 16% practice monogamy.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundamentalist/200806/why-are-there-virtually-no-polyandrous-society-0
Correction: 83% permit polygyny but most people in those societies are monogamous. 16% of societies permit monogamy only. Polygyny is permitted in all islamic societies, but typically less than 10% of marriages are polygynous in Moslem countries.
ReplyDeleteJoseph Smith was married to 11 women who were already married and he did not ask these women to divorce their first husbands. He was involved in polyandrous marriage with 11 women.
ReplyDeleteI think it's nothing but a mess to do.
ReplyDelete"Polygyny is permitted in all islamic societies..."
ReplyDeleteI know you mean polygamy.
Islam is the religion of Muslims.
Polygamy is permitted in the Islamic faith according to the Qur'an (Sura 4:1-6) but may "...differ between the various traditions within Islam (such as Sunni, Shi'i, or Sufi), and between different periods in history." [The Qur'an, English translation by M.A.S. Abdel Haleem]
Not for me. I can't handle my one family!
ReplyDeleteCan you imagine the Birthday HELL you would be in?
ReplyDeleteI believe that if it were a freedom, not a religion, it would be so much different. What about Hugh Hefner with 18 yr old Kendra and 2 others? That was just A-ok with America. I can see where two older ladies might share a man.
ReplyDeleteRappers do it all the time, they just don't marry them
Janellekody, I agree, while most people think Hugh Hefner is disgusting, nobody is shouting for him to be arresting for co-habitating with 2 teenagers. I guess it's only threatening when guys who want to sleep with more than one woman also want to be in a committed relationship with those women. As long as he just wants to bang them & move on, everyone is safe.
ReplyDeleteNo, Nysha, it's when they want to have 100 babies they can't afford.
ReplyDelete