In 2011, the Sister Wives Blog started out as a place to talk about the TLC reality show "Sister Wives", Kody Brown and his wives Christine, Robyn, Meri and Janelle. Today we not only discuss the show, we discuss Polygamy in our society, and the public perceptions of the Mormon Religion. We discuss "Polygamy USA" and will be covering "My 5 Wives."
This blog is geared towards the adult reader, so please, no one under the age of 18 years. Thank you!
please spell this out for me. I am so confused. so what? are they going after the Browns? leaving everyone else alsone to continue welfare and abuse? I'd like to hear your opinion. I seem to be able to follow you. it is all so confusing. small town gal who thought when you broke the law, you got in trouble for it!
Specifically, it's hypocritical for an officer of the law to pick and choose. If he's not going to prosecute polygamists, why should anyone obey the law? I don't care to get in trouble with the law when it's being enforced in a choosy kind of way. Justice is impossible in such a situation. Cannabis users are up in arms over all of this. It seems the Attorney General will look the other way while polygamists break the law, unless someone decides to smoke a joint. That gets you thrown in jail.
Selective Prosecution according to the AG's own personal agenda/pet peeve or personal favorite entity to protect by looking the other way. Typical good ol' boys club political mentality. Sweet!
Man, this is a sad state of affairs. Make it legal then, or at least set into place where they can not play the welfare game, as we saw Chrisitne did! poor thing, 6 kids, living ALONE.
Because it is tied to the state constitution, making it legal is almost impossible outside of the Supreme Court, and when they consider the issue, it won't be only about the Browns, but also even if unmentioned, the specter of what it would mean to have other religions that practice polygamy able to do so. It will also look at what it means to estate law, and family court. Not to mention precedent, all of which goes against it, and the media stories of abuse within it. I'm hard pressed to see how they win, but the Supreme Court is always something of a crap shoot, and it is pretty much the only game in town regarding overturning this issue.
About having the law on the books but not enforcing it? The truth is, this is how most of our lives are governed. There is no way we could enforce every broken law, and even if we could, enforcement likely isn't the real social benefit it seems. But this doesn't mean you want to repeal the law, just that you recognize human limitation and the complexity of society. The law has never been about being "fair" it's about justice, which is a much more murky and nuanced and often disappointing ideal. On the other hand, it is often for more humane and practical.
Even better, that author is Christine's first cousin once removed! I actually started that book a couple of days ago. TG93 (can't log in on phone either)
Basically if enough people start doing something illegal then it becomes untouchable, at least in Utah. Don't the Brown women realise that if they were to overturn the law that it will make polygamy legal for the likes of the FLDS, Kingston Clan and the other 'bastards', not just their 'good' polygamy people of the AUB like themselves. Stupid women. Maybe however, by decriminalizing, ie not enforcing the statute, then they will feel comfortable in claiming their children on the birth certificates and then not be able to claim benefits......ya reckon? HAHAHAHAHA
Seems pretty clear that someone is using the Browns to try to push a polygamy case to the Supreme Court. I don't think the Browns themselves are smart enough to be behind it all.
I also think it's pretty savvy of the attorney general to go to the press and reiterate that they will not prosecute, but only defend against lawsuits. This completely invalidates the Brown's argument that they had to move to Vegas, which inflicted emotional damage, because they were afraid of prosecution. I followed a link in the article and found this to be very interesting:
"Before the show "Sister Wives" premiered on TLC, Shurtleff also assured the Brown family in particular that they wouldn't be prosecuted, according to Friday's ruling. [Former Attorney General] Shurtleff could not be reached for comment Friday.
"It is clear that an objective threat of prosecution by the state of Utah does not exist," Waddoups wrote." http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/53442461-78/utah-county-waddoups-state.html.csp
So their "fear" and "need to move" was complete fabricated. Surprise surprise.
If the father has no assets, even when he is listed, the women will often still get benefits. And at least some of those benefits will go to the legal wife (such as social security, pensions, 401k,etc ) unless she signs off that she gives them up (and some you legally can't do that.). Can anyone imagine Meri signing over her right to assets to her sister wives? No way. So the latter wives are always screwed, even if it decriminalized, and they will almost always be eligible for taxpayer based benefits such as food stamps, pell grants, reduced school lunch, etc.
I still don't get why the Browns are so hot to pursue this. Being legally married to Kodouche means they can't all run to the welfare office as single moms with no dad around when they go broke again. How can these jokers be fighting for their "legal rights" when they really should be investigated for past welfare fraud? Such shifty grifters.
Un-freakin-believable! ..These "plyg family's/ cults" their just gonna keep growing, (like some nasty disease) spreading their abuse, rape, child labor, their brain washing, the welfare fraud, ect.. And why wouldn't they?..it's not like anythings going to happen to them after all! I personally don't see the law taking the time to check up on any of the kids in these plyg homes. Something really BAD has to happen before they usually step in.. That's just sad!
The only reason they even looked at the Brown's was because they went on tv and said; we're coming out, we're breaking the law, AND we're gonna do it right in front of you. (then they stuck their tails between their legs and ran to Vegas) "You don't wanna mess with those badass Brown's"..lol
What really bothers me, The Brown's did this (FOR MONEY) they claim it's to show.."not all plygs are bad"..fine whatever! ..But, when Kody says stupid crap like..WHERE ARE MY SLAVES? (I've heard that one a lot)! Or when Kody goes a week or more without seeing some of his kids because he's too busy with another wife and her kids. (don't they all live in the same housing complex)? ..When all the wives are constantly crying because their jealous, miserable, angry and tired of being alone to raise all their kids by themselves because he's never there. ..And when most of their kids already know "THEY DON'T WANT TO BE PLYGS WHEN THEY GROW UP" they've seen first hand what it's like.
..As hard as The Brown's might try to show their family is soooo different from the other "bad" plygs out there.. I for one still see way to many similarities!
I'm not saying the Browns are bad people, but I do think they made a very bad decision when they decided to live this lifestyle. It's too hard on the wives, (who feel stuck now) no matter how much they try to deny it, and the kids never had a choice in the matter. Just as I'm sure the kids didn't have a choice if they wanted to go public or not!
Then again, with all the Evil in today's world. Murders, child abuse, rape, theft, ect.. And the struggles in everyday lives anymore.. People losing their jobs, Homeless population growing, children starving all over the world, ect..
I can't help but wonder..am I just nitpicking as far a the Brown's are concerned? (Warren J. on the other hand "piece of crap", I'd have him & his kind castrated)! I have to admit watching the Brown's and all their flaws..they could be so much worse. They keep a roof (HELL, FOUR ROOFS) over their kids heads, they have plenty of food, an education (when their not skipping), clothes on their backs, and you can tell that their Moms love them. I'm sure Kody does too, he just has way too many kids and he's never around them enough to show them.
My heart goes out to all of the kids who live in some of these plyg homes will have to endure rape, child labor, brain washing, ect.. along with many other 1-2 parent homes where children are being abused. ..And I am extremely "ASHAMED" of anybody out there who can look away and pretend it never happened.
Some guy calling himself Nephi Jessop Barlow tried to get after me. He got a couple of my posts deleted. All I did was ask him how many teenagers he was married to. Then he tried to debate. What a witless wonder!
Be kind to him Cosmo, he lost everything he had, including his children when Warren Jeffs reassigned them to another man as father, in 2003: http://flds101.blogspot.com/2009/05/flds-people-101-nephi-barlow.html
One of his wives was Ellen Grace Young. She somehow either abandoned or had her and Nephi's two young children taken away from her sometime around 2006. She left to live in San Antonio, after she had been reassigned to Merril Jessop in 2004. They lived with Barbara and Merrill Jessop (the two who gave away their 12 year old daughter to Warren Jeffs as his wife, after she had already been sexually abused by her brother) on the Yearning for Zion ranch. The two kids were among the last 8 children that the CPS in Texas gave back to their parents, in this case to Ellen. http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700248628/Removal-is-sought-of-8-FLDS-kids-again.html?pg=all [It says on several other articles like here http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2008/aug/05/state-seeks-removal-of-eight-flds-children/ that it's not two daughters, but a son and a daughter. Most articles state "two daughters, one age 9, the other age 10". One daughter's name is Hannah according to CPS docs.]
Hypocrisy will prevail.
ReplyDeleteplease spell this out for me. I am so confused. so what? are they going after the Browns? leaving everyone else alsone to continue welfare and abuse? I'd like to hear your opinion. I seem to be able to follow you. it is all so confusing. small town gal who thought when you broke the law, you got in trouble for it!
DeleteI, too would like to hear you on this!
DeleteSpecifically, it's hypocritical for an officer of the law to pick and choose. If he's not going to prosecute polygamists, why should anyone obey the law? I don't care to get in trouble with the law when it's being enforced in a choosy kind of way. Justice is impossible in such a situation. Cannabis users are up in arms over all of this. It seems the Attorney General will look the other way while polygamists break the law, unless someone decides to smoke a joint. That gets you thrown in jail.
DeleteSelective Prosecution according to the AG's own personal agenda/pet peeve or personal favorite entity to protect by looking the other way. Typical good ol' boys club political mentality. Sweet!
Deletelove your comment over there, Troy. yes, protection will continue as always in Utah. nothing new here.
ReplyDeleteThank you.
DeleteAlso found it interesting that in the comments that follow in that article, the assertion is that the Brown wives are highly educated. *Not!!!*
ReplyDeleteAnother comment states that the Brown family has never sought nor received of welfare benefits. Again......not true !!
So much for reliable information. Information that is readily available to anyone, including government officials.
Man, this is a sad state of affairs. Make it legal then, or at least set into place where they can not play the welfare game, as we saw Chrisitne did! poor thing, 6 kids, living ALONE.
ReplyDeleteBecause it is tied to the state constitution, making it legal is almost impossible outside of the Supreme Court, and when they consider the issue, it won't be only about the Browns, but also even if unmentioned, the specter of what it would mean to have other religions that practice polygamy able to do so. It will also look at what it means to estate law, and family court. Not to mention precedent, all of which goes against it, and the media stories of abuse within it. I'm hard pressed to see how they win, but the Supreme Court is always something of a crap shoot, and it is pretty much the only game in town regarding overturning this issue.
ReplyDeleteAbout having the law on the books but not enforcing it? The truth is, this is how most of our lives are governed. There is no way we could enforce every broken law, and even if we could, enforcement likely isn't the real social benefit it seems. But this doesn't mean you want to repeal the law, just that you recognize human limitation and the complexity of society. The law has never been about being "fair" it's about justice, which is a much more murky and nuanced and often disappointing ideal. On the other hand, it is often for more humane and practical.
Even a member from the Browns AUB wrote a book disgusted with the abuses under the name of religion. - Dragonfly
ReplyDelete(I can't do my handle name from my phone)
Even better, that author is Christine's first cousin once removed! I actually started that book a couple of days ago.
DeleteTG93 (can't log in on phone either)
What is the book titled? Thanks
DeleteBasically if enough people start doing something illegal then it becomes untouchable, at least in Utah. Don't the Brown women realise that if they were to overturn the law that it will make polygamy legal for the likes of the FLDS, Kingston Clan and the other 'bastards', not just their 'good' polygamy people of the AUB like themselves. Stupid women. Maybe however, by decriminalizing, ie not enforcing the statute, then they will feel comfortable in claiming their children on the birth certificates and then not be able to claim benefits......ya reckon? HAHAHAHAHA
ReplyDeleteSeems pretty clear that someone is using the Browns to try to push a polygamy case to the Supreme Court. I don't think the Browns themselves are smart enough to be behind it all.
ReplyDeleteI also think it's pretty savvy of the attorney general to go to the press and reiterate that they will not prosecute, but only defend against lawsuits. This completely invalidates the Brown's argument that they had to move to Vegas, which inflicted emotional damage, because they were afraid of prosecution. I followed a link in the article and found this to be very interesting:
"Before the show "Sister Wives" premiered on TLC, Shurtleff also assured the Brown family in particular that they wouldn't be prosecuted, according to Friday's ruling. [Former Attorney General] Shurtleff could not be reached for comment Friday.
"It is clear that an objective threat of prosecution by the state of Utah does not exist," Waddoups wrote."
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/53442461-78/utah-county-waddoups-state.html.csp
So their "fear" and "need to move" was complete fabricated. Surprise surprise.
If the father has no assets, even when he is listed, the women will often still get benefits. And at least some of those benefits will go to the legal wife (such as social security, pensions, 401k,etc ) unless she signs off that she gives them up (and some you legally can't do that.). Can anyone imagine Meri signing over her right to assets to her sister wives? No way. So the latter wives are always screwed, even if it decriminalized, and they will almost always be eligible for taxpayer based benefits such as food stamps, pell grants, reduced school lunch, etc.
ReplyDeleteWhy not just make it legal? This is completely illogical to me.
ReplyDeleteI still don't get why the Browns are so hot to pursue this. Being legally married to Kodouche means they can't all run to the welfare office as single moms with no dad around when they go broke again.
ReplyDeleteHow can these jokers be fighting for their "legal rights" when they really should be investigated for past welfare fraud? Such shifty grifters.
I believe they are asking for decriminalization not legalization.
DeleteI love the show think their great family.
ReplyDeleteUn-freakin-believable! ..These "plyg family's/ cults" their just gonna keep growing, (like some nasty disease) spreading their abuse, rape, child labor, their brain washing, the welfare fraud, ect.. And why wouldn't they?..it's not like anythings going to happen to them after all!
ReplyDeleteI personally don't see the law taking the time to check up on any of the kids in these plyg homes.
Something really BAD has to happen before they usually step in.. That's just sad!
The only reason they even looked at the Brown's
was because they went on tv and said; we're
coming out, we're breaking the law, AND we're gonna do it right in front of you. (then they stuck their tails between their legs and ran to Vegas) "You don't wanna mess with those badass Brown's"..lol
What really bothers me, The Brown's did this (FOR MONEY) they claim it's to show.."not all plygs are bad"..fine whatever! ..But, when Kody says stupid
crap like..WHERE ARE MY SLAVES? (I've heard that one a lot)! Or when Kody goes a week or more without seeing some of his kids because he's too
busy with another wife and her kids. (don't they all live in the same housing complex)? ..When all the
wives are constantly crying because their jealous, miserable, angry and tired of being alone to raise all their kids by themselves because he's never there.
..And when most of their kids already know "THEY
DON'T WANT TO BE PLYGS WHEN THEY GROW UP" they've seen first hand what it's like.
..As hard as The Brown's might try to show their
family is soooo different from the other "bad" plygs
out there.. I for one still see way to many similarities!
I'm not saying the Browns are bad people, but I do think they made a very bad decision when they decided to live this lifestyle. It's too hard on the
wives, (who feel stuck now) no matter how much
they try to deny it, and the kids never had a choice
in the matter. Just as I'm sure the kids didn't have a choice if they wanted to go public or not!
Then again, with all the Evil in today's world. Murders, child abuse, rape, theft, ect.. And the struggles in everyday lives anymore.. People losing their jobs, Homeless population growing, children starving all over the world, ect..
I can't help but wonder..am I just nitpicking as far a the Brown's are concerned? (Warren J. on the other hand "piece of crap", I'd have him & his kind
castrated)! I have to admit watching the Brown's and all their flaws..they could be so much worse. They keep a roof (HELL, FOUR ROOFS) over their kids heads, they have plenty of food, an education (when their not skipping), clothes on their backs, and you can tell that their Moms love them. I'm sure Kody does too, he just has way too many kids and he's never around them enough to show them.
My heart goes out to all of the kids who live in some of these plyg homes will have to endure rape, child labor, brain washing, ect.. along with many other 1-2 parent homes where children are being abused. ..And I am extremely "ASHAMED" of anybody out there who can look away and pretend it never happened.
Some guy calling himself Nephi Jessop Barlow tried to get after me. He got a couple of my posts deleted. All I did was ask him how many teenagers he was married to. Then he tried to debate. What a witless wonder!
ReplyDeleteBe kind to him Cosmo, he lost everything he had, including his children when Warren Jeffs reassigned them to another man as father, in 2003:
Deletehttp://flds101.blogspot.com/2009/05/flds-people-101-nephi-barlow.html
One of his wives was Ellen Grace Young. She somehow either abandoned or had her and Nephi's two young children taken away from her sometime around 2006. She left to live in San Antonio, after she had been reassigned to Merril Jessop in 2004. They lived with Barbara and Merrill Jessop (the two who gave away their 12 year old daughter to Warren Jeffs as his wife, after she had already been sexually abused by her brother) on the Yearning for Zion ranch. The two kids were among the last 8 children that the CPS in Texas gave back to their parents, in this case to Ellen.
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700248628/Removal-is-sought-of-8-FLDS-kids-again.html?pg=all
[It says on several other articles like here http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2008/aug/05/state-seeks-removal-of-eight-flds-children/ that it's not two daughters, but a son and a daughter. Most articles state "two daughters, one age 9, the other age 10". One daughter's name is Hannah according to CPS docs.]
Nephi lives in Virginia now.
Sadly, that what happens when you enter a cult can take your children. I have sympathy, but should be a warning for others.
DeleteInteresting conversation here:
ReplyDeletehttp://cosmophilosophy.blogspot.com/2011/12/im-not-violent-person-at-all.html?showComment=1355772201239#c7941202994596953339
Excellent. I' m impressed.
Delete