Rebecca Kimbel talks with Kristyn Decker about the extreme dual standards in polygamy, where men live a life style every day that is increasingly better than that of their wives, where women are held responsible for that which they have no control over and where a wife's value is based on her willingness to martyr her emotions, desires and dreams for acceptance in eternity and survival in everyday life.
Gosh, these guys really demonstrate that this is a prison of the mind. Women have no alternative if they want to be saved. I found it interesting that Kristyn didn't know of any polygamous family that was happy. Her commentary about how the poor husbands were also out of their depth was enlightening. Of course the husbands couldn't be decent husbands, fathers or providers for their families when their whole aim in life was to bring spirit children into the world for their future planet. It's not humanly possible to be an attentive husband or father with that many wives and children. The lack of love; the teaching that these women did not deserve anything at all; they were chattels, their job was to submit to the man no matter what... This is appalling. As these women say, human beings need love. If we don't get it, we have an instinct to try to earn it. Hence the wives competing over what they fed their husbands. These women know polygamy from the inside. What continual heartbreak that system is. Their job is to suffer. The more they suffered the better the reward in eternity. At least, in some cases, when they got past child bearing age, it seemed that some of the sister wives had a kind of detente and worked together because the jealousy had faded a bit. I would still prefer to be unmarried than to share a husband with anyone.
ReplyDeleteAMEN Well said.
DeleteYou would think that after several years of SWB and all the chatter and interviews and info provided about polygamy, I wouldn't be enraged watching a discussion like this one.
ReplyDeleteBut I was....newly and deeply enraged.
Listening to Rebecca and Kristyn describe how the men/ the gods enjoy being doted on by the desperate, insecure wives was infuriating. We can clearly see how Kody enjoys *that* role.
How the women/mothers must feed their children as meagerly and frugally as possible in order to afford and serve full course, lavish meals for the occasional fly-by visit from the man.
That rather than feed their kids consistently good and plentiful food, it is the lord and master who eats well in whichever house he graces with his presence. The wives save for that special day and for that meal to win favor from him. And how some men only come for the meal and the booty call (if the wife is still young or still in favor). They don't come for the children or for the emotional needs of the women.
Just for the food, the sex and for issuing orders. Appalling......just appalling.
How the women crave and crave recognition and attention (love) from these harem masters and were (are) willing to do *whatever* it takes to achieve even a crumb of validation from him.
How the men get to go on outings, dinners and trips routinely and regularly with this wife or that wife, or even go trolling for a new wife, while the wife/wives whose turn it isn't is left to wait her turn. AND to watch the kids of the wife who is the chosen one for that dinner or that trip.
We have discussed frequently here at SWB how Kody gets "to go" on every event and trip. He is feted and served by all of his harem and is never at a loss for attention, even adulation from them, all of them (yes, including Janelle who was especially vocal in praise of Kody this season) Nor is Kody ever at a loss for being out and about and entertained.
The part of the video that addresses the toll all of this takes on the women has been increasingly easy to see with the Browns. The depression and mood disorders caused by months/years of internalizing, of keeping sweet, of denying one's heart and soul's needs is deeply destructive. It is the stuff of situational mental illness.
For the women of polygamy, this so-called *lifestyle* is anything but life-giving....!!
It is life-*limiting* !!
I think Kody was chasing after Janelle. Maybe because he didn't havemuch book learning. He wants her to straighten out the money situatiom. She bring in money too. Give big sons. I think.he told Meri that Janelle was chasing after him. But he wanted her in family. She always worked brought in money so they could live off her. Janelle doesn't have much self worth. Maybe cause her 1st marriage didn't last too long. The offer from Kody seemed good to her cause she wanted a family & would give up love for family. But both Meri & Kody treated like a enterloper. She knew she wasn't happy in this relationship. By then she was having children & she loved her children. Might be first love since her parents. So now she was happy.
DeleteAmused... your post reminded me of something that Robyn said (I think during the interview show). She said that she enjoyed the fact that she could feed the kids mac and cheese when it wasn't her night with Kody. Could just be an off-the-cuff remark, but looking at it in this context makes you wonder. The Browns are way better off financially than many of the other polygamists, but I'll bet that Kody still gets the best of everything (like how he took a spoonful out of everyone's mock tapioca as they walked by). I think I could stomach the lifestyle a lot more if they were all living together under one roof sharing all the resources equally. Instead, it seems like Kody gets the frosting off the cake and everyone else has to fight for the crumbs.
DeleteCanadian Ginger,
DeleteHmmm......I remember that remark.
While it could just be that Robin was just referring to an easy dinner...
Or it could be more about that when the King is at the table....she must go all out.
...Like any obedient, accomadating plyg mistress is expected to do.
Great interview. I'm struck again by Kristyn's poise, calm and how articulate she is. If you haven't read her book, order it and read it because it is exceptionally fascinating. Tell me again how in the heck Christine could be afraid of this woman?
ReplyDeleteChristine is probably not really afraid of Kristyn, but the truth that Kristyn speaks. I suspect that Christine knows if she listens to Kristyn, she will have to acknowledge her own unhappiness.
DeleteChristine is afraid of Kristyn because she is so articulate and clear thinking - UN-brainwashed! I believe Christine will follow in the ways of her mother and aunt by getting divorced. Christine is the wife that has been put on the shelf - so to speak. I think she comes from a family of strong women, but stays with the Brown harem because of the lack of motivation to work outside of the home. Christine needs a lot of attention and is quite demanding, that is why her baby daddy runs from her.
DeleteThis discussion reminded me of the "4 dates" episode--where Christine was in the ice cream palor laying her head on Kody saying "I'll be a better wife" or something to that effect. She was craving physical and emotional attention from Kody, so much so, that she was apologizing to him! It is so sad. Zero self esteem right there. Pity, pity, pity. I want to say Christine you are so much more than that! You deserve better.
DeleteFascinating interview. Thanks for posting it.
ReplyDeleteWhat amazes me most is how polygamy creates the family dynamics of junior high where everyone is trying to get the attention of the popular boy, and all the girls who have a crush on him have to compete with each other so they all end up hating and being jealous of each other. What a mess!!!
I know I continually harp on this, but people need to understand the power the man holds in the Mormon religion as the priesthood holder who have the power to literally resurrect his wife from the grave in the afterlife. If you believed your husband held that much power over you, you'd be much more willing to endure abuse so he would remember to call you forth out of the grave when he had his own planet. If a man leaves the Mormon church, the elders advise the wife to divorce her husband, and will help her find another husband who is a 'worthy priesthood holder' so she won't lose her eternal salvation--that's how whacko Mormonism is!! And of course, there's no Biblical support for such a silly doctrine as it's God who will call forth the dead from their graves--see John 28. The Mormon church has replaced the Creator God with the husband and given him the power of life and death over his family which is why these poor women are willing to endure endless suffering at his hand.
I have created a new country called United States of Man. Anyone is welcome to enter my country if they agree to my laws and they are of the following:
ReplyDelete1. Every man must have a minimum of 2 wives and the open mindness to have more in the future.
2. The women's number one duty is to please their husbands before themselves, their children, parents, or any other.
3. The women will not complain if they do not have enough money, time, or love coming from their husbands, it will be the women's duty to live with that.
4. The women will act as if they love and enjoy each new woman that the husband brings into the family and put her own feelings aside.
5. The women will never show their own true emotional feelings.
6. The women must agree to have as many children as their body will tolerate whether they want more children or can afford more children or not.
7. The women must agree to be delirously happy with scraps of love, time, and attention given to them by their husbands no matter how small it is.
8. The women will never complain. Their feelings do not matter in this country.
9. I will write new laws as new questions come up by the women of this country.
We have had over 600,000.00 citizenship requests from men wanting to join our country so far. We have not had any requests from the ladies as of this date. Cmon ladies Come and get your 1/8 or 1/19th slice of the pie!!!
WHO WANTS TO JOIN?
My previous posting ID was OrangeMeri Whine. I have decided not to support the Browns in any way by posting about them any more as it just gives them more publicity, which in turn supports their sickening and degrading lifestyle. I will continue to post on the subject of polygamy on this blog, just not on the Browns.
As I was reading made me sick. I don't know what to say sent chills thru me. I hope the Browns stop winning. Your list really put it in prospective. When the show first started I thought they were innocent slugs that just wanted to live their lives. I think they fooled us all. This last season got pretty boaring. All that means any thing to them is the almighty dollar.they us everyone including their kids.
DeleteI wanted to comment on Anonymous' statement about Christine Brown being so afraid of her aunt Kristen. I'm sure Christine knows that what Kristen says is true, and it makes her very uncomfortable. Look at how many times Christine has mentioned wanting to be the 3rd wife because that's the minimum number of wives a man needs in order to achieve the highest level of godhood in Mormon theology. Unless a man is very wealthy or powerful, he probably stops at 3 so the third wife is the apple of his eye, and gets all the attention. Look at what happened to her when Robyn joined the family--her world fell apart.
ReplyDeleteI hate to say it, but earlier wives and concubines take a certain malicious satisfaction is seeing the latest toy discarded for a newer one. There's the attitude that "now you know what I went through." Roll on Robyn's come comeuppance.
DeleteHayley, Absolutely right, I think she thought she was "safe" as the third wife. I think Meri got even with Robin.
DeleteI'm glad u got out. Did anyone help you? Do u see your family? Were u able to trust anyone & get married. I know lot of questions but I learn from u & read everything u write. Are u going write a book Were u trusting enough to get married? R u still morman? I know lot of questions if u will answer whats concortable. Thanking u for your insite
DeleteGod Bless Kristyn, Carolyn, Rebecca, and all of those who share their stories of escape and shine the light on the evils of these "religions"!
ReplyDeleteWhen I first started reading the books from those brave souls who escaped this cult, I was outraged and wanted to do whatever I could to help the women and children.
I have since realized it's not just the women & children--the men have also been enslaved by the lies fed to them from birth. No role models for being a father, being encouraged to keep their noses "brown" in order to rise up the internal political ladder, and living in terror of being "poofed".
The lies that have indoctrinated these people have filled them with terror when they consider the consequences of escape. Living with the unhappiness, cruelty, and abuse inside the cult is preferable to the eternal damnation they are threatened with for leaving. It's the only way of life they have ever known and they have nothing with which to compare.
I wondered why the State of Utah hadn't tried harder to pursue the lawlessness and the lack of education of these individuals. More reading has convinced me that the LDS run State is afraid of the backlash that would happen if the majority of the population realized that the FLDS and the AUB openly practice the "principles" that the LDS has in their "scripture". Asking questions or accurate historical research regarding the convicted con man who dreamed up all of this by sticking his face in a hat and staring at a couple of rocks is also discouraged. Too many questions by LDS members will get them excommunicated and shunned,
Utah legislators who have tried to pursue the cults have not been re-elected.
If you live in any of the states where these cults are "planting", encourage your legislators to read the books we SWB readers have read, to become educated in the ways that the cults ingratiate themselves into a community, and not to be tempted by the $$ the cults wave under their noses! These cults are like a real time version of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers".
If the cults stay in those states, campaign to have strict Education testing and standards for the schools and Home Schools. Cult members have no voice-- only their "prophet"-- so we must speak for them!
Great insight. I've always thought the men were just as enslaved as the women. No role models, just this cult behavior. Kody is different though. he wasn't raised in it and should know better. we all know it's not the religion with him, he barely knows it.
DeleteCompound W's comment is so true. One of the greatest difficulties in trying to "help" the folks caught in polygamist cults is that the thinking members are regularly weeded out and cast out. Many of the remaining folks are caught in the "I believe", "It ways in the Book of Mormon, Bible,etc." or "We were raised to . . ." traps. Any discussion brings out very defensive responses and they have been taught to expect folks to try to attack their belief system. Very early in the Sister Wives programs Christine said something like, "I just wanted to pull out my Book of Mormon and show them where they are wrong." One can't help folks who won't accept help or change religious views of folks who believe they have the only pipeline to god.
DeleteI'll just bet any redress for the polygamists' cults will have to be legal with penalties. Just hope the Brown's lawsuit fails in Utah's courts!!
Compound, that's so true!! I keep wondering how to help people who are imprisoned in this toxic belief. I am also reading through the books recommended on this blog. It seems that those who escape have one major issue: they are SO miserable in plural marriage, they decide that eternal damnation has to be better than the hell they are living. Basically, that's the first chink in the armour of terror based mind control.
DeleteIf the individual doesn't decide to leave because of this, it's going to be almost impossible to rescue them.
In my studies on abusive religious cults, I have learned that this is the major issue in terms of getting people out. If someone decides to leave because they disagree with their next door neighbour, or they have a fight with a leader, they have NOT decided that the cult's teachings are wrong. They might live outside the group headquarters, but they still believe that this is the only way to heaven. They might have been kicked out of the organisation, but they still try to follow the teachings.
I have personally spoken to several people in this situation. Just three weeks ago, I was asked to speak to a woman who had been a Jehovah's Witness for 20 years and wanted to leave. In the course of our conversation, I realised that she had been banned from attending the Kingdom Hall because she was in trouble for some minor infraction. She wanted to join a community Christian church. She still believed the JWs teachings and therefore she wanted to pick and choose which bits of this little church's teachings she would believe. I found that interesting. If you are a JW, you have to believe absolutely everything they tell you. Yet this woman wanted to belong to a different church and expected them to follow her beliefs, not the other way around.
She asked me to recommend a version of the Bible that DIDN'T have the Trinity in it. I told her that doesn't exist. She insisted it must.
Like they say, you can take the plural wife out of fundamentalist Mormonism, but you might not be able to take fundamentalist Mormonism out of the plural wife (and kids). This is why Kristyn, Flora, Kollene, Rebecca and all the others are so important to this work. They know exactly how this belief system imprisons people. Because of that, they are better at guiding defectors through the minefield just outside the compound gates.
Great insights and comments on this thread! And it is because of all the things discussed here that I always get a strange and uncomfortable vibe in the populated areas of Utah and other Mormon dominated areas in other states...but most especially in Salt Lake City. When we drove through there last year I was glad we drove thru quickly and back out into the majestic, unpopulated scenery.
ReplyDeleteThank you Kristyn for sharing your story.
ReplyDeleteSuch a sweet woman. Shame on Christine.
ReplyDelete