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Thursday, June 28, 2012

Lehi Police Report on the Browns

Here are the newly released documents from the Lehi Police Department regarding their 2010 investigation of the Kody Brown family. Courtesy The Salt Lake Tribune.

Read the article at:
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogspolygblog/54390325-191/browns-lehi-police-report.html.csp


Lehi Police Report on Sister Wives


125 comments:

  1. Now I know Town/County/State cops don't miss things by not connecting, but here is a Police statement, clearly showing Welfare fraud, put together with the last Bankruptcy. Come on folks, put it together.

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    1. No joke. This looks straightforward to me. They knew it was illegal, went on TV anyway, and then acted surprised about it. Why haven't these people been arrested yet?

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    2. Serendipidydodala and a plate of nachosJune 28, 2012 at 7:55 PM

      They skipped town. Then Utah says they will not press charges unless abuse or fraud is proven. Maybe this is why the Browns will not even consider going back to their original home. They have committed fraud, they know it, the state knows it. But they sure aren't going to admit to that on their show. Utah may say the aren't pressing charges but saying and doing are two different things, they may just be waiting for them to waltz back into town and try to live there again...I think the Browns realize this as well. That's part of why they are so hot to stay in Vegas.

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  2. YeeHaW
    This is the BEST POLYGAMY BLOG EVER!

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  3. SalaciousStinkEyeJune 28, 2012 at 11:19 AM

    I love how the investigator says that Meri was instrumental in Kody getting other wives... especially Robyn.

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  4. Answers a lot of people's question.. They changed their name to Brown....

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  5. The Police definatly have a fraud case.

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  6. Nothing more than what we all saw in our tv guides describing the show. No investigation on how they support themselves ? No referral to ADC or food stamp dept? No suggested action or pursuit? Clearly Christine used separate address for services, Robyn on welfare as she joins family, wonder how long after the wedded bliss that was claimed? Bankruptcy fraud causing consumers and tax payers to support their lazy fat asses! Why do these people get to swindle every angle and bamboozle the authorities? Back in the day I had neighbors on welfare that used to get inquires of men living with them and threat of losing services. There has to be some sort of follow up now a days on services or are they just given with no qualifications?
    These people are the lowest of bottom dwellers and act all high and superior to the sharks that feed them. The system sucks!

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    1. BewareOfThePlanetYouChooseJune 28, 2012 at 4:09 PM

      I guess no one has complained. An email started this mess. How much more obvious can it be?

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  7. Actually, to the first anonymous above, the report clearly stated that they did not find any evidence of welfare fraud (among other things).

    I've been reading the blog for a little while now and I have just one suggestion about the above report. You may want to black out the addresses in the report that you posted. While the report is "technically" in the public domain, if there was any sort of problem at the house and it was connected back to your website (someone saying they found the address there etc), you could be held liable. Just saying.

    Otherwise, great blog. A little (lot) on the snarky side but most of the time, it's deserved. And, bad me, I do find a lot of it pretty funny :)

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    1. Do we have any legal eagles on here? In my opinion public record is just that, open to all for viewing. Thanks for saving me a few key stokes on my search engine.

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    2. The document is public record. The document actually resides on a different website, which allows embedding of its image viewer for use on other websites. The link for the website is above the image viewer.

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    3. pervious robotmonkeyJune 28, 2012 at 8:05 PM

      It was downloaded to scrib'd by Lindsay Whitehurst, who writes the polygamy blog at the SL Trib. She linked it in one of Trib blog entries. SWB has nothing to fear by embedding it.

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  8. This might be a really silly question, but couldn't some Utah resident just present the Lehi police with the bankruptcy documents and ask for the investigation to be re-opened? I don't live in the States, so it's clearly none of my business, but surely Utah tax-payers have a vested interest.

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    1. Don't some public welfare funds come from the federal government? If so, then any taxpayer in the US has a gripe with these people. I thought the food stamp program was funded by the Dept. of Agriculture.

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  9. I new here on the blog, but saw these references to welfare fraud and bankruptcy. Does anyone know those things for sure, or is that a guess?

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  10. Interesting read. However, the amount of misspellings in the document are distracting.

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    1. This is pretty typical of police reports. I once read one about a man who took his tv to the pond in order to get his dog out of the pond. Took me half an hour to figure out he meant that he pawned the tv in order to get the dog out of the pound. The report was written by a cop w/many years experience, too.

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    2. Agreed. You wonder how "rigorous" the reporting was.

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    3. i'm pretty sure you don't have to have more than a high school diploma or a ged to be a lehi cop. it's pretty small beans and it is a hick town - even as far as utahns are concerned. ;')

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    4. clarification - not that you shouldn't still be able to spell with a high school diploma tho. lol

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    5. Have you ever watched a cop take a report? They have to write a lot of info very fast. I have seen many spelling and grammar errors on reports but I understand why. I often want to be judgemental when it comes to grammar but am learning not to, especially now with auto correct messing a lot of words up. I don't know if cops get to correct their 1st reports but I doubt it so there will be many spelling errors. That doesn't mean they are a bad cop, I would rather have a good cop who can't spell than a bad cop who can spell. :)

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  11. since I'm guessing Meri is the only documented marriage and there is no paper trail, the state can't do anything. if he had married the other three and signed actual state documents it would be polygamy charges. Plus a lot of times all the kids are homebirthed so there is no legal documentation and again if the state wants to spend the money to confirm by DNA tests of the other 12 or 13 kids are actually his. Unless there is apparent abuse like the Colorado City case, they aren't going to waste the state funds. The Browns set the house up like a roommate situation and that's how they get away with what they do. It is wrong to bleed the system and manipulate but they aren't the first and not the last.

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    1. IMO just because the kids are homebirthed (except for Truly) doesn't mean there is no legal documentation - for one thing in order to claim them on their federal tax forms ALL the kids need Social Security Numbers. and there are so many instances in just regular life where a birth certificate is mandated - when the kids want to apply for a driver's license, or go to school, or need a passport (traveling to Mexico does require a passport since 9/11).

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    2. Still doesn't mean that Kody put his name on any birth certificate. Just the way they seem to function but Kody didn't have to put his name on Truely's birth certificate just because it was on tv. Off topic but wouldn't Robin get child support from her first husband?

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    3. Yup but there's plenty of evidence just via the TV show and the book to demonstrate that Kody is their dad. What's he going to do if the kids or the state take him to court - deny it?

      If I were one of his kids and knew that my dad chose not to list himself as my father on my birth certificate, I would leave as soon as I could and never look back.

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    4. He is the master of all things slimey and just deviantly deceptive, so its probably something he would do. I wonder if Robin's child support goes to her non Brown kids or in Kody's vacation money...

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    5. Just some questions in case someone knows how this works - when a child is born at home, how does the mother apply for a birth certificate? Who signs it, since there is no doctor or midwife there?

      Can the state force Kody to do a DNA test to prove he is the father? Would that matter as far as assistance is concerned? I guess it isn't illegal to father many children by many mothers, but if their relationships are all current, does it affect public assistance?

      Thanks for answering!

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    6. i had a home birth and my certified midwife signed and filed the birth certificate with the state. we also registered and filed for the soc sec #. it's the law in both cases.

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    7. @DakotaJustice the kids don't need a passport to get to Mexico. Only Kody and Meri get to go there!

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    8. Lol Ziggy, maybe not now but at some point in their lives, more than likely at least some of the children will need/want to travel outside the US. A birth certificate comes in VERY handy.and as Anon 5:33 says, it is the law to have a BC and a SSN now.

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  12. You all get the best info. My opinion is that since only Kody and Meri are married in the legal system there is no bigamy. I firmly believe religious ceremonies where there are no victims (underaged or forced marriages) are no ones business other than the participants.

    I also don't see where there bankruptcy or welfare are fraud. Morally reprehensible yes but fraudulant I'm not seeing it. The truth of the matter is that Janelle, Christine and Robin are single mothers. I doubt seriously that prior to SW, Kody made all that much money nor did Janelle as a state worker. Even if the government garnished his wages to support the 12 children, I think Christine probably still would have qualified for food stamps since she had no income (I doubt very seriously that Janelle or Meri paid her for babysitting/teaching their children.

    The book stated and gave many examples where Meri and Kody don't manage their money well and were underemployed. Janelle made a decent living as a state worker but it would be hard to support 6 children on it.

    This is not to say I think any of them have made good choices. Janelle, Christine and Robin had children they couldn't afford which I think is irresponsible to say the least. Kody took on wives he couldn't afford. They are all just one big hot mess but it makes for interesting tv watching and blog reading!

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    1. SammyMom, I remember in the first season Janelle talking about how she preferred working outside of the home. Part of the whole plural marriage thing she loves is that Christine was home all day with the kids so there was no need to pay for daycare. Kody even said that was Christine's financial contribution to the family because her being home saved money. You're right about Meri and Kody not managing money well too. Remember when Janelle and Kody went away for their "weekend", it may have been their anniversary....anyway, they went camping and Janelle packed blankets and pillows from her house to sleep on and Kody freaked yelling, we'll stop and buy some sleeping bags. At the time Janelle said that Kody's answer to everything is to buy it, hers is to use what they have. I think Janelle has been bearing the brunt of managing the finances with these jokers who call themselves grownups.

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    2. yes, it's become abundantly clear that there's no real communication in how best to run this as one large family. it's just run as 4 separate ones and 3 before that. Janelle has no real voice so she knows, "why bother? no one cares anyway but me." Lord, it must get so lonely not to have anyone to really talk to and vent to and help with a real solution.

      They've reached the point of let's just call the bullshit about polygamy what it really is when Christine had no problem saying how she doesn't fully trust her sister wives. Not only does no one have each other's back, everyone's got their own knife to stab you in yours. Sweet!

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    3. Jules, ITA but I doubt that any money Janelle or Meri paid Christine (or shared with Christine) was officially reported as wages such as paying for social security for Christine.

      Obviously, Janelle is the most financially responsible and I do think Christine is probably pretty good at stretching a buck but neither have any real voice in the relationship.

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    4. Hi all! Great blog, I really enjoy it more than the show! I just wanted to pipe in here about welfare fraud. Food Stamps are a federal program so I am sure the qualifications are the same no matter what state you live in. Medicaid is a state run program so it varies state to state.

      In the state I work in if both parents live in the home then both incomes must be reported and they both have to be in the case. In the instance in which Kody and the three wives were living under the same roof then they should have all been in a combined Food stamp case since Kody could not have been seperate from any of the children. Kody could not be listed in three different cases.

      Now realistically they would more than likely still qualify for benefits, not as much as they would if all the wives were seperate, but I am sure they would qualify for some since there are so many of them. So if they did apply as seperate households from Kody, then there was fraud.

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  13. If the investigation was over in October of 2010 and no charges were filed - why again did they move to Las Vegas in Jan of 2011? Did they just leave all their bills unpaid? How about the house in Utah? I bet it has a ton of liens against it.

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    1. Foreclosures/liens would be public record, and there were none shown last time I looked which was a couple weeks ago. My guess is that if Meri's sister is paying rent, that is going towards the mortgage on the Lehi home - my guess is that they are upside down on the mortgage, based on their modus operandi on how they manage their finances, I am certain that they took out a line of credit on the equity they had on their Lehi house during the Real Estate Bubble.

      They've said in plenty of interviews in the past that the real reason they moved to Vegas was because Kody wanted to. The "investigation" was just manufactured drama. They don't escape their bills, since they are still in the United States, any lienholders or creditors can still come after them, as far as I know.

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    2. YES the move was to avoid prosecution....so if investigation was closed....KODI moved because he wanted to and lied to his kids. I see why they don't believe the adults.

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    3. They moved in January 2011 because that was when the AG's office began investigating whether to bring felony bigamy charges against them. The decision not to bring charges was made only about a month ago.

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  14. Because on the Bankruptcy papers Christine states their is no father in the home.

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  15. Love what you folks do - i imagine it is a lot of work, THANKS to all.

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  16. When reading though, towards the end of the document, it specifically mentions "cohabitating". That got me thinking, could this have something to do with their pipe dream of 4 separate houses? If they are in separate homes they aren't technically cohabitating. Just a thought

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    1. I agree...I always though they were going for 4 houses to avoid future cohabitation issues. That and of course the fact they can't stand each others guts!!!

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    2. yes, i think that's been the consensus of lots here for quite awhile in the reasoning why they're not talking about getting into one main house again nor returning to the one house in lehi. to get around the cohabitation/bigamy laws.

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    3. Nevada doesn't have a law like this, so it doesn't matter in Nevada.

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    4. well, then i guess that is the reason for not returning to Utah as there is a law against cohabitation but i guess it's back to their entitlement mindset for their deserving 4 separate 400K homes on their own cul-de-sac.

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    5. There's no reason not to return to Utah. They won't prosecute just for polygamy - only if there are other crimes involved. It is pretty much a safe haven.

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    6. i seriously doubt they're going to let them build a 4th apt. on the house for Sobbin'Robyn there to. She gonna have to get another trailer now.

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    7. Anon 12:29, I love the name you gave the 4th Mrs. Brown: "Sobbin' Robyn". It's perfect!

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  17. Wow. I think all our speculation about why they don't buy one large house or plot to build one large house may come down to this. If they live in separate addresses, does this also create a loophole where they can qualify for govt assistance?

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  18. I wonder why they dont return to LEHI....with so much open land..they could build cheaper and be closer to their church.

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    1. finally seeing realityJune 29, 2012 at 5:36 PM

      The only part of their church Kody believes in is having a bunch of wives. I heard that their church leaders wanted them to quit filming. You can see how he follows their direction.

      Delete
  19. If their living in a house and Kody is covering mortgage, I think that washes out any child support. With so many if they listed the wives as friends or whatever they would still qualify for benefits because its so many of them. UTAH is used to this and its not worth the time and effort or trauma to the kids.

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  20. With all the punctuation errors and misspellings, I can't seem to take the report seriously. Proofread, people.

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    1. Word.

      Also: Word. They should use Word. Spell checker and grammar tool. They need to use Word.

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    2. Oh, but man! On line 3 of the 2nd page (5 of 10), it actually says "pervious marriage!"
      I love it when misspellings give away the truth!

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    3. Allyn; Smiled out loud at your comment. Comments.

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    4. Ditto to what Pen Elaine wrote. hahaha

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  21. Also, where are pages 1-3 and 10?

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    1. I'm guessing they omitted the pages which contained specific details on the children. Even though we all know their info, still I believe it's the law.

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  22. We DontUseChineseKidsBuyOur JunkJune 28, 2012 at 3:37 PM

    Here's the thing: After the last fiasco, the obvious wefare fraud won't be dealt with. This isn't the east coast. 1/2 the town are Poly.
    While folks who really need it can't.
    Robyn can still get it b/c of the Aspberger's Syndrome, and that will stand for all her kids.
    They have so many forces behind them, many quite EVIL from overseas wanting in.
    I'm telling you, there's more to this story, and allowing Polygamy will be a great downfall for our County.

    Let's face, look at Robyn's defense answers. They are not educated, Janelle, I have no clue why she's there, but if she does believe the religion so much, I admire she is giving her children a choice, not b/c she says it, because the children show it.

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  23. SammyMomJune 28, 2012 12:54 PM said
    "My opinion is that since only Kody and Meri are married in the legal system there is no bigamy. I firmly believe religious ceremonies where there are no victims (underaged or forced marriages) are no ones business other than the participants."

    In Utah this is bigamous since they are "purporting to be married" This may seem a trivial distinction from just "living together" but I think it's an important one. Most of the women I know who were living in polygamy would never have dreamed of sleeping with a married man, and the only way to get them to do this is to 1. tell them that they have to do it to be accepted by "God" 2. Tell them that if they don't they will be "destroyed" and 3. offer a ceremony that gives the illusion of a real marriage. And as for "no victims" even adult women are victims under this kind of pressure and manipulation (not to mention the ensuing children who also suffer for what their parents are doing).

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    1. when you're raised in a religion-based polygamy or even as an adult who "chooses" polygamy that's religion dictated, it's really not a free will of choice. I'm all for an adult freedom polygamy choice when there's no religion basis to it but notice how next to nil that is for participants?? almost all polygamy is religion based and it's almost 100% polgyny and never polyandry. think about it.

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    2. I understand where you are coming from but I believe that their right to practice their religion in the way they see fit is a right I would defend. The 4 Brown women chose and continue to choose this lifestyle even though they could leave. Honestly, I feel that Women are victimized in a lot of religions not just Mormon Fundamentalists but I think it's a slippery slope when we start getting involved with religious choices that adults make.

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    3. why do they have a right to have a religion w/a practice that's clearly against the law tho? and in all 50 states? where do we start drawing the line on that? why don't we defend anyone who wants to start religions up with other practices that are also against the law but they're ok because it's their right to practice their religion???

      makes. no . sense.

      go get the law changed and THEN start your religion practice LEGALLY. i think God would approve of that. ;')

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    4. I want to start a religion that says it's ok to shoplift and not pay for parking tickets nor my taxes. I shouldn't have to pay the piper if i'm caught cause you're stepping on my religious beliefs rights!! ;'p

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    5. How about religions which mandate human sacrifice? lol.

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    6. About the comment from Anonymous "why do they have a right to have a religion w/a practice that's clearly against the law tho? and in all 50 states? where do we start drawing the line on that? why don't we defend anyone who wants to start religions up with other practices that are also against the law but they're ok because it's their right to practice their religion???

      makes. no . sense.

      go get the law changed and THEN start your religion practice LEGALLY. i think God would approve of that. ;')"

      The law was made after the practice in this case the Mormon religion as a whole at one point believed in polygamy and practiced it. It was not until the laws were being made to make it illegal that the two Mormon churches became separate, one choosing to uphold the law regardless of their original religious beliefs and one keeping to the original beliefs about polygamy.

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  24. Christine's bankruptcy papers tell it all...no father listed (hence no child support) & welfare even though the Krew with jobs were supporting her. Oh yeah, they were also hooked up with TLC but checks were being paid through their entertainment company.Grifting at its finest!

    Same on you Utah....

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  25. "I did not locate any evidence that suggests these individuals are committing any other crimes commonly associated with the practice of Polygamy including welfare fraud..."

    Well, how hard did you look???

    And if the case is that while they did indeed file multiple bankruptcies and did indeed receive food stamps, but they were not technically being fraudulent, then perhaps what should really happen is that the rules need to be overhauled in order to prevent people from getting government benefits from intentionally having umpteen children on purpose that they can't take care of themselves. You know, something like you have to name the father of children and/or have dna testing in order to get benefits. In conjuction with that limit the number of children that one father can get benefits for. Not retroactively because that would harm children already born, but it would be a deterrent to keep adults from reckless breeding on the public's dime. Or perhaps, once a father has reached his allotted number of children and he still wants public assistance, make him get snipped. I know that sounds kind of crazy but it's crazier that anyone would think that they're entitled to have the public pay to raise the kids they had on purpose when they can't afford it.

    There's lots of smart people on this blog...maybe you guys could come up with better suggestions on how to nip this in the bud.

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    1. I don't remember what website I was on or the exact words but from what I understand Utah is less apt to prosescute for welfare fraud because MOST of the people in Utah have ties to this lifestyle even if they don't live it. So for them to prosecute these people would be like saying the religio n is wrong.

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  26. There is a good video here detailing the bankruptcies and fraud:

    http://www.realscam.com/f35/sister-wives-kody-brown-catting-around-declaring-bankruptcy-getting-food-stamps-907/

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    1. Interesting, I just read Christine's bankruptcy paperwork. She owed $2,206.00 to Best Buy (the electronics store) but in personal property claims a TV for $100.00, a TV/VCR Combo for $25.00, and a DVD player for $25.00, and $85.00 worth of Books, Compact Discs, DVDs, Tapes, and Collectibles. That is a total of $235.00...wonder where the rest of the $1,971.00 worth of electronics went??

      http://www.scribd.com/doc/57590942/Detailed-Assets-Debts-in-the-Bankruptcy-Filing-of-Sister-Wives-Star-Christine-Allred-Brown-3-2010

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  27. The details in this report just drives and drives the point home that these people are VERY skilled at the scam. They know the ins and outs, the labels and non-labels necessary to skirt the laws. They stay just inside the safety zone, grabbing the handouts, while thumbing their noses at the system.

    I wonder....is there a "Bleeding the Beast 101" course offered (required) in all plyg communities??? There must be since it seems that all seem to know the drill. Especially since these Browns, singularly or collectively, do not seem smart enough to have figured out all the possible plyg-related scams by themselves.

    The list is long of how, and for how long, this particular family has been 'bleeding the beast. Ironic isn't it that they now want the tax-paying, working members of the "Beast" to buy their junk jewelry and sell their liquid laxatives and contribute to a "fund" to get them their Mc Mansions?

    Thinking of Robyn whining with SUCH convincing sad eyes about her babies not even having a crib..then reading that in 'her" bankruptcy, it listed over a $1000 debt to Victoria's Secret? What mother would have her baby do without a crib and be okay racking up that $$ for lingerie??? Mentioning this one because it is recent and documented. The other wives who stuck others in 'their' bankruptcies probably have just as much shocking abuse of a system.

    I am so disgusted because along with their use and abuse of the system, (even when being paid by TLC at the beginning) their other continuing "fraud" is their relentless "information fraud"....
    the contradictions and lies, the twisted insinuations both spoken and written...that they continue to produce with no guilt or conscience at all.

    They ALL continue to thumb their nose at those who support them in one way or another.

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  28. the utah plygs are generational "bleeding the beast" pros. they know all the ins and outs of the system. for the most part, elected officials look the other way unless for one reason or another, there become some huge public stink about it w/an individual. then that individual only is dealt with i.e. Tom Green.

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  29. Interesting factoid. The Lehi home was purchased from a Jessop. More AUB royalty. Not sure there is any problem with the fact the address is noted here. The address information is readily available from the utah county tax assessor online. Unlike California, one can actually search by grantee or grantor name in Lehi and get the actual address of the property. Looks like another loan was taken out against the property in 2009 for 45K. The fact that the address is widely known is not the best situation for the current perons living there. She is using the address also as a business one with her name right on there. That's scary.

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  30. ProFirstAmendmentJune 28, 2012 at 6:09 PM

    I don't see anything wrong with people living together and purporting to be married, that's a first amendment issue. They should have the right to call the other women whatever they want. Wives, Mistress, girlfriend, teddy bear, it doesn't matter.
    That being said I don't like the Browns at all, they are not the great shining example of polygamy that they set out to be.

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    1. Right, it's not like Grody tried to fraudulently get legal marriages with the other three so who cares?

      Indeed they are not shining examples of marriage--plyg or not--and there are tons of monogamous marriages out there that are pure dysfunction too. They are just some of the few who get a reality show and blast it all over.

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    2. If it was just about 5 consenting adults, well, que sera sera; they can all go to Hell together. BUT, to bring kids into this mess is criminal, and should be prosecuted as such. You can tell from the interviews that the older kids do not want a thing to do with this fraudulent lifestyle. So, no matter what these dumb asses say about how they have a 'family unit', with love and respect, the proof is in the pudding, so to speak. The KIDS make them all stupid LIARS and frauds. Unfortunately, the parents are too delusional to realize this. BOYCOTT these idiots.

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  31. The Browns have made it seem as if they're discriminated against because. Of their religion/poligamy. I think most people here don't care about the relationship dynamic.

    The problem is theft, fraud, and lies...and crying victim while taking things they haven't earned.

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  32. Long time lurker, first time poster. It sounds like people are reacting to this police report as if it's news. I think it's not. I think that this report is what prompted Utah AG to launch an investigation in January 2011 into whether to bring bigamy charges against Kody et al. My understanding is that the Browns won't be prosecuted unless there is evidence that some crime other than bigamy has been committed. This police report has just become public because the criminal investigation has been closed.

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  33. ProFirstAmendmentJune 28, 2012 at 6:27 PM

    I agree they should be prosecuted for the welfare fraud. Just not the polygamy.

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  34. What type of government job did Janelle have? Is this how they learned about food stamps etc?

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    1. We dont know...she had to keep it private in order to keep her job when they lived in UTAH.

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  35. The Passion of the NachoJune 28, 2012 at 6:51 PM

    Random--Does anyone know how old Robyn is? I'm just curious and a Google search didn't help much. I saw she was married in 1999 so I'm wondering how young she was then.

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    1. she and DPJ were both 20 (give or take a few months--I forget which months were involved, but she was born in 78 and he was born in 79).

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    2. I think she's around 33 or 34ish. Somewhere in that age range.

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    3. The Passion of the NachoJune 29, 2012 at 12:37 PM

      Thanks everyone!

      Delete
  36. Lobotomized (ColdSoreCheeseNachos)June 28, 2012 at 6:51 PM

    I have thought about it for a lot. They all are not particularly clever and have a high school level of thinking, at the most (yes there are a lot of high schoolers that have a way higher level of thinking than them, I'm talking the plain joe simple high school kid). Many of them have difficulty reading long and/or a tad more "difficult" words. They are very, very simple minded/not smart. They don't understand a lot. Yet, when it comes to bleeding the beast they seem to all have at least a master's degree level in it if not a PhD level... Food for thought!

    (Excuse me if my English is off, English is not my first language).

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  37. I've been trying to find the numerous bankruptcy filings to which people are referring. I found the papers for Christine's bankruptcy filing on the internet, but did not see that the other wives had filed bankruptcy. Also, with respect to welfare fraud, exactly what fraud do people think the Browns have engaged? Is there some proof of this that I'm missing? Please, don't get me wrong, I'm not a Brown family apologist. I'm persuaded that even the kind of polygamy the Browns practice is based upon misogyny, which is awful. I'm persuaded that while the Browns really thought that they were going to be able to present their "lifestyle" in a positive light, it's just not possible given what polygamy is all about. It seems to me that in this family, no one gets their needs met, except, maybe Kody. My problem, I guess, is that people are throwing around accusations, which I think are pretty serious, and I haven't seen evidence to support them.

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    1. See Gladys 72 below, she's answered that somewhat, also videos on it. So to our search tool and look for "Bankruptcy" we have them or links to them on here!

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    2. Thanks, Mister Sister!! (Great name, by the way.)

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  38. Thanks for putting this up.
    You guys have all the documents. It's great.

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  39. OT, but an interesting exercise is to watch some videos from S1 of SW. Wow! How everyone has changed, physically AND emotionally. It's hard to recognize the show at all compared to this past season.
    Here's a link to one of the videos:
    http://tlc.howstuffworks.com/tv/sister-wives/videos/best-of-2010-sister-wives.htm

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    1. We have ALL the clips on this blog, also!

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  40. Here's the thing. They our out of the State, and the State is over them. Welfare fraud is pretty open and accepted. Not being bossy, but beating a dead horse connecting that to this report. It's not worth their while.

    I have practically read this whole blog this past week. Other post that might make it clear is this about welfare. Go to this post: http://sisterwivesblog.blogspot.com/2011/06/sister-wives-absolulty-used-welfare.html

    Then looks at Susan's posts. In them, *she tell us where to go to see the bankruptcy filings. The police could easily read these. Unless there has been no compaints, and at this point even if they were, it's over, so to speak. Folks in the Police Dept. are in the church, I would assume, not for sure, but would bet on it.
    I am confident in saying Utah says good bye, good riddens, and would love to know what the church thinks now.

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  41. Doesn't look to me like Utah had the SWAT team ready to bust up this "perfect" family. Why run away Kodouche??? Why cause your children such emotional pain? Why force Christine away from her church and Janelle to quit a job she loved?

    He is such a flaming tool

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  42. Bingo! I have to wonder if "Bleeding The Beast 101" was part of their private (when they were in Utah, I know they're in public schools now) school curriculum? Is it in the Mormon homeschooling kits? Or is it a word of mouth sorta thing? Because I was raised to believe that welfare is hand up, not hand out and definitely not a way to "steal a living". Their scheming etc is wrong on so many levels that I can't even begin to understand it. Oh and the wives chiming in on how they want their kids to live this lifestyle is surprising since I doubt there will be a reality show for all 150 of the kids by the time they're done. How much more will their children's lifestyles take away from the taxpayer? Ever been to a VA hospital? The conditions are sometimes appalling - I'm a nurse so I see it all. These are the people who should be receiving help, as well as the upcoming senior citizens who have to choose between medicine and food. These fools don't have to worry about that though and they continue to breed.

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    1. "Ever been to a VA hospital? The conditions are sometimes appalling - I'm a nurse so I see it all. These are the people who should be receiving help, as well as the upcoming senior citizens who have to choose between medicine and food. These fools don't have to worry about that though and they continue to breed."

      Yes, have seen that too and agree.

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    2. Thank you Amused. I cannot stand the way some of their supporters act as if they're not hurting anyone with this lifestyle and we should just let the poor, persecuted "religious" people alone. I'm not religious and personally don't care how many wives, girlfriends, whores etc anyone has as long as a. they support themselves and b. they keep their kinky activities away from their kids. They could have a circa 1974 double wide parked in the desert for their swinging activities and I could careless. BTW, I am being sarcastic, I don't think the Brown's are kinky just lying, scheming thieving POS (the adults). Have all the babies you want, just pay for them yourselves and I mean entirely pay for them. No food stamps, no section 8, no medicaid - nothing from the government. Part of my paycheck should not go to support your desire to fill your magical celestial kindgdom with more and more children. Hoarders much? ;) I'm sorry but the veterans and the senior citizens who've worked their whole lives should be getting more of the limited pie of funding than the lot of you. Why has Meri not been working a fulltime job for at least the past 15 years? Why is Robchin not working now since Christine is available for future Prophet Solomon and bonus children sitting? And then there's the biggest tool of all Kind Koolaid Kody. You're LIV gig isn't a job! Also, don't scam your way into credit cards and steal from the banks/stores issuing them because that gets passed down to me. I would be ashamed to sit up on that stage and lie like that bunch does, goes to show their true moral code if you ask me.

      Sorry for the rant. I've just had too many days of holding back tears on the floor and barely making it to my car before losing it after taking care of these veterans and senior citizens. Most try to hide the fact they haven't eaten in order to buy medications. This is so freaking wrong and now TLC is showcasing this "lifestyle" to the world. Thanks for the blog and for listening to me moan away. If you're like me and could careless about watching these leeches on TV, please don't watch them. Take them off your dvr to record (I made that mistake, wasn't watching but it was still recording so they get the ratings numbers). If you love watching it for the clown show it is, more to ya. Life is short, gotta laugh when you can :) My friend apologizes for watching but then fills me in before I read here so I understand the compulsion to watch this train wreck. I'm working on a list of advertisers. I'm gonna boycott their products but don't know if that will make a difference or not.

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  43. LookingforLaughternotlaughingsomuchnowJune 28, 2012 at 8:48 PM

    I am new to this blog, and I no longer think this is funny. I went on these people's website and this green drink they are selling they claim calms, gives you energy, cures addiction to sodas, prevents road rage, and are promoting this as safe for children by saying it helps the baby (Christine said this) "poop" ( her words), and helps her children focus on homework, plus helps her with dealing with them doing homework! I didn't even read what it did for K and R. Scared that might be too much information. Maybe I missed it, but I saw no ingredients listed. I cannot believe someone has not checked into this! It could be colored water, but if some crazy fan gave this to their child to "poop" and this child had an allergy to the coloring...this is just unbelievable. I can't believe no one has checked into this. From the unprofessional website they have (and the one for FF is for sale), I have a hard time believing they actually checked the legalities of what was needed to be done before selling something like that. This could be dangerous! Does anyone have any information on this stuff?

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    1. All I can say is that I think the promotional claims that they make on LIV International's website are illegal. There are no statements that the product is not intended to treat, cure, or evaluate any disease per FDA regulations.

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    2. I am a distributor for Advocare, which hails its spokesperson as Drew Brees and not an asshat like Kody Brown. We are not allowed to make any claims whatsoever outside of our personal experiences and our materials and products have the standard FDA disclaimer. So I am pretty sure that LIV is worth Ignoring.

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  44. LookingforLaughternotlaughingsomuchnowJune 28, 2012 at 9:06 PM

    I believe bankruptcy hearings are filed and held in federal courts. All that is usually (or my state) required is a list of assets and debts. Number of children, who is or isn't in the home, etc is not requested, and of course income is requested. You are allowed to keep a vehicle if it is paid for or as with your home, you can exclude these from bankruptcies, but of course you have to continue paying for them. Every debtor is given a time period after being notified of your filing and has a right to attend the hearing or send a representative. Most do not show up, except Sears who usually has a representative at every one of them (don't aske me why). After the bankruptcy hearing there is still like a three month period before an Order is issued, but pretty much if the debtor did not appear at the hearing to dispute it, their rights to collect are forfeited. Which is why nobody is going after them for back debts, they are wiped clean!

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    1. LMAO! you hit the nail on the head Looking for laughter. I had to file in 2000 b/c my ex husband decided he didn't want to be married anymore moved out and left me with all the bills. Anyway, the only ones that showed up at me hearing was Sears and it was only for 200.00

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    2. LOL. SEARS SHOWED UP FOR ME TOO. LOL THEY WANTED THEIR OLD FANTOM VACUUM AND LAWN MOWER.

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    3. I used to work in the Sears credit department almost 40 years ago. I remember having to send a request for representation at bankruptcy hearings. It's just surprises me that they STILL do that. And yes, we had to itemize every item purchased, the amount and the date, using FIFO rules. It was a headache.

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  45. backtolookingforlaughterJune 28, 2012 at 9:46 PM

    Glad you are laughing. Thought it may have sounded like I was ranting, and didn't mean to! LOL@Sears! My only guess is the only one that can go after them is the government (surprised IRS hasn't checked into that). I know prostition is legal in NV, is pylg? Also got on another computer and looked at the green drink. Ingredients were listed (tiny), and the one for weight loss contains fructose! According to Kody he has dropped from a 36 waist to a 34. I don't see that, do you?

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    Replies
    1. Where is he measuring his waist? Is it the area between the tub of lard he carries on his belly, and his hips?

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    2. After the Mexico episode, Kody looks like a solid 38" waist and solid B cup.

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    3. I emailed them before this season started asking if their LIV products were safe for pregnant/breastfeeding mothers.... Still haven't gotten a response.

      Delete
  46. Utah has a precedent of combining common law marriage with their civil code barring bigamy. But they usually only bother if the family is being a thorn in someone's side, for other criminal reasons or by being too out and public.

    And polygamists do not corner the market on welfare fraud. Advocating economic eugenics won't fix the problem.

    You want to confuse a welfare caseworker, be aboveboard in a poly household. The rules aren't designed to account for it. Incomes count one way for a legally married couple, another for unmarried (officially) cohabitation, differently for medicaid and food stamps, and children get a share of each parent's income...and while a household who eat together, can all count together for food stamps, if they maintain separate kitchens and eat separately much of the time, they can count as separate cases. Odds are, how to do it is as much how a caseworker interprets it as anything else. It's more usual to just count a mom and kids separately from another mom and kids even if they live together, and the dad can only count once--if they all claim him, it's fraud because you can only be on one case at a time.

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  47. Serendipidydodala and a plate of nachosJune 29, 2012 at 1:34 AM

    Linnet: Finding out Stevia is in that green goo explains everything. There is all kinds of videos of some crazy guy on the internet (living in his mom's backyard shed) claiming Stevia brought his dead cat back to life. He also challanges UFC fighters in his spare time. The Browns must be a friend of his...lol.

    LookingforLaughter: On the other page you wondered if anyone else thought the Browns were in this for what they believed was a great money train. That's exactly how I feel about them. I think Kody and Meri are professional con-artists. I don't believe a word they say (and that includes Meri's whining, too much about it don't make sense but I won't get in to all that) but think it's all part of the manipulation. I don't really think Janelle and Christine are quite as bad but they know what's going on so they aren't completely innocent either. Trapped, maybe, in Christine's case and I think Janelle's biding her time to get her payback at this point. Never trust anyone who's whole life is a poor me story, especially when it's about money and 'need', it's part of the game.

    I know it's several pages back but this place is on fire and reaching comment limits before I can get one in....that jewelery??? Good grief, I had to look at that one charm (the hands) for ten minutes trying to figure out what it was. And it stills looks like bony witch hands practicing strangulation techniques. Visual Freudian slip, Robyn? I think so.

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    1. Serendipidydodala and a plate of nachosJune 29, 2012 at 2:06 AM

      This post I made above at 1:34...I was actually trying to put it in the newest discussion area. Not sure how I managed to get it here but is there anyway to toss it over there instead?? Sorry, computer savy I am not.

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    2. Sorry Serendipidydodala but we are unable to move comments around...

      Delete
    3. Serendipidydodala and a plate of nachosJune 29, 2012 at 4:16 AM

      No probs...thanks for letting me know. I'll get better at this newfandangled interwebz one day :)

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  48. I don't think Kody's motives for wanting Logan to attend UNLV are pure. Yeah, he would miss him but not the way most parents miss their kids when they leave for college. Logan strikes me as more of a father-figure to the kids than Kody. If Logan went away to SUU, Kody might have to step-up and actually be a dad and not just a "stud". Honestly, the five oldest kids seem to have it more together than the adults.

    As I listen to the wives, the first three wives, discuss their self-esteem issues, I say to myself, "No, kidding." I would think it would be hard NOT to have self-esteem issues when your husband is away from you and your kids because he is spending time with one of his other wives. Has that ever occured to them?

    And what is up with Robyn? She makes these "philosophical" statements and then looks to Kody for validation. It is as though she says what she thinks Kody would want to hear and then looks at him for an "atta girl!" Can she think for herself? And wanting to be Meri's surrogate? Please. Again, a less than pure motive. She enjoyed the attention she received when she was pregnant. She knew that once Solomon was born she was just be one of the four again. Being Meri's surrogate would ensure her time in the Kody spolight. Does she think we are as easily led as she?

    One more thing, Kody's eyes. Is it just me or does he look like a crazed animal?

    (I orinially added my comments in the wrong area. Sorry.)

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  49. OMG Robyn has to be preggers again! Look how she didn't join them for this Anderson interview airing today!!!

    http://www.andersoncooper.com/episodes/kody-brown-sister-wives-flds-former-teens/

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    1. That show was taped when Robyn was in her last weeks of pregnancy with Solomon. She didn't appear because she wasn't allowed to fly!

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    2. every time someone posted to make sure we watched today's Anderson show, I kept posting underneath that it was a rerun from last September. I'm sure there's still the discussion thread we had about it archived here.

      I kept trying to inform ahead of time, CJ! ;')

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  50. I thought I posted this this yesterday, sorry!

    http://sisterwivesblog.blogspot.com/2011/09/anderson-tomorrow-sister-wives-and.html

    You can always use our search on the right, but if folks find it on their own and it is relevant, please post!

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  51. One other point -- there hasn't been a person tried for outright, and ONLY polygamy in the state of Utah since 1972. Every other court case has been because of either a child molestation charge (child "brides") , transportation of minors across state lines, or some sort of financial racketeering.

    I'm very skeptical that Utah wanted to press charges EVER. The state hates things like this (and especially with a possible Mormon presidential contender, I'm sure they would have preferred not to have this coming up right now.) Plus, many Mormons have a great-great grandparent who was in plural marriage and outright condemning seems a little hypocritical to them. But honestly, the law is CLEARLY on the books, and Utah prides itself on being a law and order culture, so if you (ie, the Browns) are going to go on national television and shove this in the state's face, how is going to look if you (ie, State of Utah) do not at least try to uphold the law? The law, because it is part of the state's constitution, is not an easy one to remove. (It was required to be part of the state constutition in order for Utah to gain statehood.)

    But all of those shows about how the police were coming after them? That was either pure television or paranoia. Might even have been both. It could have been genuine fear on the parts of some, and stoked feelings on the parts of others. Because let's face it, fear and thinking you are being persecuted brings people together like nothing else. And fear and thinking you are being persecuted also allows people to be controlled. And people that are being controlled do what you want them to do. And although they all seemed to have created a very pleasant life for themselves in Lehi, UT, they all ended up doing what it was that Kody (and television) wanted them to do.

    Draw your own conclusions!

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  52. Very interesting!!!!!

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