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Thursday, July 21, 2011

One Big, Happy Polygamous Family, by Jonathan Turley

Since the Browns have filed a lawsuit, it is important that we read both sides of the issue, and be kept abreast of what is going on. This article from the New York Times is from Jonathan Turley, who is representing the Browns in their Decriminalization of Polygamy lawsuit. The article below are his views on the subject. You may read the lawsuit at this site, and we encourage you to do so:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/60242003/Kody-Brown-Sister-Wives-Polygamy-Lawsuit-Jonathan-Turley

Jonathan Turley:
SINCE the Supreme Court’s 2003 decision in Lawrence v. Texas, Americans have enjoyed unprecedented freedom in their lifestyles and private relationships. The decision held that states could no longer use the criminal code for social engineering, dictating the most intimate decisions of citizens in their choice of partners and relations. But even as states have abandoned laws criminalizing homosexual and adulterous relations, they have continued to prosecute one group of consenting adults: polygamists. 

Last week in Utah, one such family filed a challenge to the state’s criminal law. That family — a man, Kody Brown, and his four wives and 16 children — is the focus of a reality program on the cable channel TLC called “Sister Wives.” One of the marriages is legal and the others are what the family calls “spiritual.” They are not asking for the state to recognize their marriages. They are simply asking for the state to leave them alone.
Utah and eight other states make polygamy a crime, while 49 states have bigamy statutes that can be used to prosecute plural families. And they’re not a small population: the number of fundamentalist Mormon or Christian polygamists alone has been estimated to be as high as 50,000. When Muslim as well as nonreligious plural families are considered, the real number is likely many times greater. 


The case of the Browns, for whom I am lead counsel, is a clear example of unacceptable government intrusion. The family has not been accused of child abuse or other crime, in almost a year of being under criminal investigation. With such allegations stripped away, the only thing remaining is a family that does not look like those of other Utah citizens. The question is whether that is enough to declare them criminals. 


While widely disliked, if not despised, polygamy is just one form among the many types of plural relationships in our society. It is widely accepted that a person can have multiple partners and have children with such partners. But the minute that person expresses a spiritual commitment and “cohabits” with those partners, it is considered a crime.
One might expect the civil liberties community to defend those cases as a natural extension of its campaign for greater privacy and personal choice. But too many have either been silent or outright hostile to demands from polygamists for the same protections provided to other groups under Lawrence. 


The reason might be strategic: some view the effort to decriminalize polygamy as a threat to the recognition of same-sex marriages or gay rights generally. After all, many who opposed the decriminalization of homosexual relations used polygamy as the culmination of a parade of horribles. In his dissent in Lawrence, Justice Antonin Scalia said the case would mean the legalization of “bigamy, same-sex marriage, adult incest, prostitution, masturbation, adultery, fornication, bestiality and obscenity.” 


Justice Scalia is right in one respect, though not intentionally. Homosexuals and polygamists do have a common interest: the right to be left alone as consenting adults. Otherwise he’s dead wrong. There is no spectrum of private consensual relations — there is just a right of privacy that protects all people so long as they do not harm others.
Others have opposed polygamy on the grounds that, while the Browns believe in the right of women to divorce or leave such unions, some polygamous families involve the abuse or domination of women. Of course, the government should prosecute abuse wherever it is found. But there is nothing uniquely abusive about consenting polygamous relationships. It is no more fair to prosecute the Browns because of abuse in other polygamous families than it would be to hold a conventional family liable for the hundreds of thousands of domestic violence cases each year in monogamous families. 


Ultimately, the question is whether polygamy is allowed under the privacy principles articulated in Lawrence. The court did not state exclusions for unpopular relationships. Writing for the majority, Justice Anthony M. Kennedy said the case “does not involve whether the government must give formal recognition to any relationship that homosexual persons seek to enter” but rather “two adults who, with full and mutual consent from each other, engaged in sexual practices common to a homosexual lifestyle.” 


The Browns are quite similar. They want to be allowed to create a loving family according to the values of their faith. 


Civil libertarians should not be scared away by the arguments of people like Justice Scalia. We should fight for privacy as an inclusive concept, benefiting everyone in the same way. Regardless of whether it is a gay or plural relationship, the struggle and the issue remains the same: the right to live your life according to your own values and faith.
Jonathan Turley is a law professor at George Washington University. 
(Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/21/opinion/21turley.html?_r=1)

38 comments:

  1. Why does he always talk about Muslim? Are they that prevalent in our society? Does he represent them, too? To me, that hurts the case. Polygamy from Mormons we are used to, Muslims have always been thought of as treating women terrible. Turley seems determined to intertwine the two, and always bring up the gays, another totally different thing.

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  2. HANNAH, oh HANNAH, where are you now? hiding? What's wrong with this FAIR PIECE? I think your a piece of crap that's a shit stirrer. Shut the F up.

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  3. By the way, NICE of MS to show both sides of the story, what do we call that...ummmm Democratic?

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  4. This case will never be heard in court - in order for a case to be heard in court, the Browns would have to be charged with something - and they have not been charged with anything. Another publicity stunt.

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  5. Once society decides that one-man, one-woman no longer is the “arbitrary” standard, on what rational basis do we stop at one-and-one?

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  6. And the fact that in many, if not most, polygamist families, most of the women are on welfare, due to being single, unemployed mothers, how is that not a cost to the public? And what happens if the husband dies? Do all the women collect widow’s Social Security benefits from one man?

    In the days of the Old Testament, when polygamy was all the rage, it was for the purpose of taking care of women who had no property and no wealth. A woman did not inherit her deceased husband’s property, the eldest son did. Womem were left to fend for themselves. There was no social welfare net to fall into.

    That system went by the wayside a long time ago.

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  7. Goodnite Mr. JeevesJuly 21, 2011 at 9:20 PM

    By George, the more I read, the more I don't understand. He makes a helluva point, but not crazy about always bringing in the Muslims. (In my best british accent)

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  8. Polygamy was in the Old Testament - so was slavery.
    Anyone up for taking a few slaves tonight ?

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  9. Isn't that why Jesus came and straightened things out, ONE man, ONE woman?

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  10. I expected to hate the Brown’s and was ready to. I watched the show and I saw a loving family. Who raises their own children – pays their own way and is not hurting anyone. So – I hope they win, and people just plain leave them alone.

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  11. Here's what I see.
    1. Make it simple, you believe in these sealed marriages, just seal to the first one. Wahla!
    2. There is no mention or discussion on any legal rights these women have.
    3. There is no provision if they get this, they must claim all income and admit they live together, quit the fake housing and get off welfare.
    4. If they are so in love with each other, why WOULDN'T they all live in one home, with one big communial kitchen/living. Not doing so says there's a problem.
    Mr. Turely is just doing his job. But, it leaves so many unanswered questions.

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  12. Wow! I'm going to have to get on here more! Lot's of comments! GREAT! We love to see both sides.
    I still don't quite understand this lawsuit. Does it make any provisions as JohnX said to help the women?

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  13. No provisions in the Turley lawsuit for the other wives beyond # 1 - the lawsuit simply supports decriminalization, no legal rights for the plural wives.
    As for the comment by Tree that the Browns pay their own way - not true, they have accepted food stamps and each wife has filed for bankruptcy.

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  14. Idea:
    When I became an adoptive parent, and a foster parent, we went through a rigorous screening, as well as classes, etc.
    When I gave birth, or took care of my step child, nada.
    Why not have some sort of screening for these polygamous families to make sure that all needs are being met, and that it's on the up and up.

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  15. When my husband died, I received 6 SS checks (one for each child and one for me since my youngest was under 16). As each child aged out of SS, the amount of the remaining checks was raised.

    My bet is if Kody were legally allowed to wed all of his "wives" and then tragically died, each wife would be entitled to a portion of his Social Security.

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  16. New kid on the blockJuly 22, 2011 at 12:52 AM

    I do absolutely have sympathy for people who break unjust laws. Anti-polygamy laws (when other laws, such as those concerning child brides, are not broken) are no less unjust than laws against gay people (very recently) or racial minorities (prior and during the Civil Rights movement)

    However, if you think Kody should go to jail, then all the wives should have to go to jail as well. Which still punishes the children more than anyone else.

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  17. Yes marriage to multiple people could get complicated, under the current laws. Why do we have to keep marriage exactly the way it is? Why not organize marriages as a form of corporation? Why not allow the individuals being married to work out a specific marriage contract that covers their situation rather than forcing all married people to use the exact same contract? We have figured out ways that businesses can have multiple contractual obligations. One person can be in contract with multiple people for multiple ways already (loans, employment, children, spouse, etc.) I’m sure we could figure out the legal ramifications of multi-partner marriages.

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  18. Notice Kadouche is on a white horse... and there's PURPLE!!!JK

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  19. What does Mr. Turley think about Warren Jeffs crew and the FLDS? Wouldn't that release them too? Is that even a consideration. Sure, if you could just say ok to the Browns, but there's so much more.....

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  20. My bet is if Kody were legally allowed to wed all of his "wives" and then tragically died, each wife would be entitled to a portion of his Social Security.

    Doesn't leave much to go around, does it, given that there is a fixed amount and there are going to be 17 kids and 4 wives ....

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  21. "Yes marriage to multiple people could get complicated, under the current laws. Why do we have to keep marriage exactly the way it is? Why not organize marriages as a form of corporation? Why not allow the individuals being married to work out a specific marriage contract that covers their situation rather than forcing all married people to use the exact same contract? We have figured out ways that businesses can have multiple contractual obligations. One person can be in contract with multiple people for multiple ways already (loans, employment, children, spouse, etc.) I’m sure we could figure out the legal ramifications of multi-partner marriages."

    I think that most of us like marriage just the way it is, thank you. Majority rules.

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  22. "...However, if you think Kody should go to jail, then all the wives should have to go to jail as well. Which still punishes the children more than anyone else..."

    I don't think anyone here thinks that Kody and his wives should go to jail. We do think that he should stop the food stamp fraud and the serial bankruptcies, and he shouldn't have kids he can't support. Food stamp, WIC, and Medicaid fraud are rampant in polygamous families in Utah.
    BTW, the AG of Utah has told the Browns in person at a conference that he has no intention of arresting polygamists unless coercion, child marriage or incest related polygamous marriages are taking place. Also keep in mind that the AG of Utah has no history of arresting women for polygamy unless they participated in coercing a child into participating in a sexual act with their husband.

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  23. Personally, i don't feel they are one big happy family. They are 4 families. Maybe Robyn is happy. The other three wives are committed to their children, struggle but love their "sister wives", yet long to have Kody's attention all by themselves. A gaggle of cool siblings does not make up for a full time dad.

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  24. Case law has not been developed sufficiently yet to permit legalization of polygamous marriages, and by legalization I mean granting marriage licenses to all of the partners in a polygamous marriage. Let's say that Janelle develops a successful business, then she decides she wants to leave the relationship. Who has a right to a portion of the assets of her successful business ? Kody only ?
    Meri, Robyn, Christine and Kody ?
    What happens if successful businesswoman Janelle dies - who inherits her assets ?
    Her children ? Kody and her children ? The other wives, all the children and Kody?
    Sounds like a mess.

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  25. I was under the impression that Utah cleared them of welfare fraud. Food stamps, WIC, and free lunches are based on income and even if all of them claimed Kody's income, there are enough people that they'd probably qualify legally. Closing whatever loophole that allows polyg. families to get these benefits would probably cause other truly needy families to be refused, also.

    I have no moral issues with having more than one wife, as long as everyone is a consenting adult. I do, however, think it's immoral to deliberately have children you are not capable of supporting.

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  26. There is no evidence that Utah investigated them for welfare fraud. They were investigated for evidence of violation of anti polygamy laws, and they were not charged.

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  27. A note about Brown family finances - at the time that Christine filed for bankruptcy, Kody made about 65,000 - 70,000 dollars per year as a salesman for YESCO (Young Electric Sign Co) and Janelle made about 60,000 dollars per year working at her job. It is unknown if Meri was paid or what Meri was paid for her job. The Browns had the Brown Family Entertainment group which received payments from TLC as well. At that time of her bankruptcy filing in March 2010, Christine received over 600 dollars per month filing as a single mother with her 6 children, and that food stamp application was filed with the assistance of the Safety Net Committee.
    Sorry folks, that is food stamp abuse. There are plenty people out there who make much less and have to support almost as many kids. Don't have kids you cannot afford, and don't lie on applications for government benefits. The AG of Utah is being very generous by not pursuing the Browns for their fraudulent bankruptcy and food stamp abuse.

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  28. There's that damn purple again, and Kody on a white whore, I mean horse hehehehehehe

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  29. Mr. Turley is very fair. He's said he's not a polygamist, nor endorses it.

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  30. Mr. Turley unfortunately fails to recognize that coercion is a prominent feature in groups that practice mandated religiously inspired polygamy. No one can truly consent in situations where brainwashing and coercion take place.

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  31. Kodee, what have you got yourself into, with the Muslims? Are the gals gonna have to cover their faces? Might be good for Robyn.

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  32. I bet he could sell bikinis to eskimos. Slick tongue.

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  33. So why on earth did they sue?

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  34. Copier, but trueJuly 24, 2011 at 1:02 AM

    The difference between a polygamist and the follower of an "alternative lifestyle" is often religion. In addition to protecting privacy, the Constitution is supposed to protect the free exercise of religion unless the religious practice injures a third party or causes some public danger.

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  35. The Lost Boys and women who have left polygamy groups reporting coercive marriage are evidence of harm.
    You cannot have a society with a religious mandate to have 3 wives per each man without harm to the young men without wives or the women who are reduced to the status of commodities gained to fulfill the religious mandate.

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  36. Does the AUB have an explanation for this? I know they say no forced marriages, bu I've never seen anything written to really explain it.

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  37. Turley's the MAN! And, helping out the right people for NOTHIN, ZIP

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